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to those that still have matco brakes...

 
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sstearns2(at)yahoo.com
Guest
PostPosted: Sun Jan 09, 2011 10:12 am    Post subject: to those that still have matco brakes... Reply with quote
Matco makes a 'brake intensifier kit' for the master cylinders. It's basically a sleeve that lets you use a smaller piston so you get more brake pressure per foot pressure.

I got the kit and installed it. It's not a night and day difference, but a noticable improvment. Without the kit my matco brakes were inadequate, but I would call them acceptable with the kit.

The kit is complete, but for some reason that I don't understand they make the customer trim down the sleeve to fit. The kits are only $16 so I'd recomment buying and extra one in case the sleeve trimming doesn't go well on one.

Scott

[quote][b]

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ftyoder(at)yoderbuilt.com
Guest
PostPosted: Sun Jan 09, 2011 8:34 pm    Post subject: to those that still have matco brakes... Reply with quote
Scott,

I did the same with the same result. If you used the kit supplied break peddles, you will get a better boost in performance by moving the master cylinder attach point as close to the rudder bar as possible. I was able to move mine about 1/2" and it made a big improvement. This was recommended by George Happ (Matco).

Tim
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gbrighton(at)skymesh.com.
Guest
PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 3:19 am    Post subject: to those that still have matco brakes... Reply with quote
Hey there Scott,
I have the Matco brakes ..so thx will check out the 'kit' ... Back last April while test flying a rebuilt Subaru transplant ..a inlet valve head broke off and caused a forced landing ....have since been hung up with finding an engine build shop that i'm confidant with .. to build another Subaru engine that i'd fly behind ......Am looking at a mid time IO-360 .... Can u tell me the weight of urs (all up complete with accessories but no prop ) ...

Would be a big turn around for me to go this way .. but am presently 'looking' at all possibilities ...!!

Cheers
Graham (TR1 # 80 )

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wschertz(at)comcast.net
Guest
PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 7:35 am    Post subject: to those that still have matco brakes... Reply with quote
I have a TR-4, that came with Matco Brakes. At first start-up and taxi, the braking action was very poor, and uneven. I could not turn right. Diagnosis revealed that one caliper had leaked, contaminating the surface. I cleaned that up, and it was ‘better’ but still not good. Did the exercise of pulling the plane and riding the brakes to ‘burn them in’ and that helped quite a bit.

Found that one caliper was still leaking, so contacted Matco.

Turns out that they had been bought out by a new owner since my original brakes were made. several changes were available.
1. a larger caliper cylinders
2. a more aggressive brake pad, and
3. they changed the material that the rotor was made of , and when I removed my calipers to send them back to be retrofit, I found that one of the rotors had a crack in it. Discussion with Matco revealed that the original rotors (which I had) were made from an easily machined material that contained graphitic carbon (which can act as a lubricant – good for machining and bad for braking), and the new rotors were made of a different alloy. Bottom line – I upgraded the caliper cylinders, and the rotors.

I have great braking now. Will hold the plane at full throttle on the ground (if the tires don’t slide on the pavement). I paid attention to the geometry at the master cylinders from the Matco literature, and did not use the wimpy brake pedals that KIS supplied.

By the way, I completed my 40 hour test requirement yesterday.

Bill Schertz
KIS Cruiser #4045
N343BS

From: Graham Brighton
Sent: Monday, January 10, 2011 5:16 AM
To: kis-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: to those that still have matco brakes...

Hey there Scott,
I have the Matco brakes ..so thx will check out the 'kit' ... Back last April while test flying a rebuilt Subaru transplant ..a inlet valve head broke off and caused a forced landing ....have since been hung up with finding an engine build shop that i'm confidant with .. to build another Subaru engine that i'd fly behind ......Am looking at a mid time IO-360 .... Can u tell me the weight of urs (all up complete with accessories but no prop ) ...

Would be a big turn around for me to go this way .. but am presently 'looking' at all possibilities ...!!

Cheers
Graham (TR1 # 80 )

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jforster(at)baisch.com
Guest
PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 7:44 am    Post subject: to those that still have matco brakes... Reply with quote
Bill,



Did they offer some discount for the upgrade process? I am still
leaning toward replacing everything with Grove, but I am interested in
the positive changes that Matco made.



And congrats on the testing milestone!



John



________________________________

From: owner-kis-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kis-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bill Schertz
Sent: Monday, January 10, 2011 9:27 AM
To: kis-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: to those that still have matco brakes...



I have a TR-4, that came with Matco Brakes. At first start-up and taxi,
the braking action was very poor, and uneven. I could not turn right.
Diagnosis revealed that one caliper had leaked, contaminating the
surface. I cleaned that up, and it was 'better' but still not good. Did
the exercise of pulling the plane and riding the brakes to 'burn them
in' and that helped quite a bit.



Found that one caliper was still leaking, so contacted Matco.



Turns out that they had been bought out by a new owner since my original
brakes were made. several changes were available.

1. a larger caliper cylinders

2. a more aggressive brake pad, and

3. they changed the material that the rotor was made of , and when I
removed my calipers to send them back to be retrofit, I found that one
of the rotors had a crack in it. Discussion with Matco revealed that
the original rotors (which I had) were made from an easily machined
material that contained graphitic carbon (which can act as a lubricant -
good for machining and bad for braking), and the new rotors were made of
a different alloy. Bottom line - I upgraded the caliper cylinders, and
the rotors.



I have great braking now. Will hold the plane at full throttle on the
ground (if the tires don't slide on the pavement). I paid attention to
the geometry at the master cylinders from the Matco literature, and did
not use the wimpy brake pedals that KIS supplied.



By the way, I completed my 40 hour test requirement yesterday.



Bill Schertz
KIS Cruiser #4045
N343BS

From: Graham Brighton <mailto:gbrighton(at)skymesh.com.au>

Sent: Monday, January 10, 2011 5:16 AM

To: kis-list(at)matronics.com

Subject: Re: to those that still have matco brakes...



Hey there Scott,

I have the Matco brakes ..so thx will
check out the 'kit' ... Back last April while test flying a rebuilt
Subaru transplant ..a inlet valve head broke off and caused a forced
landing ....have since been hung up with finding an engine build shop
that i'm confidant with .. to build another Subaru engine that i'd fly
behind ......Am looking at a mid time IO-360 .... Can u tell me the
weight of urs (all up complete with accessories but no prop ) ...



Would be a big turn around for me to go this way .. but am presently
'looking' at all possibilities ...!!



Cheers

Graham (TR1 # 80 )

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kentpyle(at)iland.net
Guest
PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 7:48 am    Post subject: to those that still have matco brakes... Reply with quote
Bill, I am most happy to hear you have completed the required testing time. Come see me when you fly into KC and we will do lunch. Kent
[quote] ---

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ftyoder(at)yoderbuilt.com
Guest
PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 9:44 am    Post subject: to those that still have matco brakes... Reply with quote
Congratulations on the 40 hrs.!!!

I met George (Matco) at OSH last year and and got that same information. I ordered the new discs and pads that I will install at the next annual.

I think John would be satisfied with the Matco Brakes with the upgrades. 'OC' told about his efforts in changing his Matco to Grove and I think it was quite a bit of work.


Happy flying,

Tim
[quote] ---

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katebob10(at)yahoo.com
Guest
PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 10:02 am    Post subject: to those that still have matco brakes... Reply with quote
To any one who may be interested. I have a complete set of Clevelands for a TR-1. Includes master cylinders, 5" wheels and tires  if needed
From: John Forster <jforster(at)baisch.com>
To: kis-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Mon, January 10, 2011 9:40:08 AM
Subject: RE: to those that still have matco brakes...


Bill,

Did they offer some discount for the upgrade process? I am still leaning toward replacing everything with Grove, but I am interested in the positive changes that Matco made.

And congrats on the testing milestone!

John


From: owner-kis-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-kis-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bill Schertz
Sent: Monday, January 10, 2011 9:27 AM
To: kis-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: to those that still have matco brakes...


I have a TR-4, that came with Matco Brakes. At first start-up and taxi, the braking action was very poor, and uneven. I could not turn right. Diagnosis revealed that one caliper had leaked, contaminating the surface. I cleaned that up, and it was ‘better’ but still not good. Did the exercise of pulling the plane and riding the brakes to ‘burn them in’ and that helped quite a bit.



Found that one caliper was still leaking, so contacted Matco.



Turns out that they had been bought out by a new owner since my original brakes were made. several changes were available.

1. a larger caliper cylinders

2. a more aggressive brake pad, and

3. they changed the material that the rotor was made of , and when I removed my calipers to send them back to be retrofit, I found that one of the rotors had a crack in it. Discussion with Matco revealed that the original rotors (which I had) were made from an easily machined material that contained graphitic carbon (which can act as a lubricant – good for machining and bad for braking), and the new rotors were made of a different alloy. Bottom line – I upgraded the caliper cylinders, and the rotors.



I have great braking now. Will hold the plane at full throttle on the ground (if the tires don’t slide on the pavement). I paid attention to the geometry at the master cylinders from the Matco literature, and did not use the wimpy brake pedals that KIS supplied.



By the way, I completed my 40 hour test requirement yesterday.



Bill Schertz
KIS Cruiser #4045
N343BS
From: Graham Brighton (gbrighton(at)skymesh.com.au)

Sent: Monday, January 10, 2011 5:16 AM

To: kis-list(at)matronics.com (kis-list(at)matronics.com)

Subject: Re: to those that still have matco brakes...



 


Hey there Scott,

      I have the Matco brakes ..so thx will check out the 'kit' ... Back last April while test flying a rebuilt Subaru transplant ..a inlet valve head broke off and caused a forced landing ....have since been hung up with finding an engine build shop that i'm confidant with .. to build another Subaru engine that i'd fly behind ......Am looking at a mid time IO-360 .... Can u tell me the weight of urs (all up complete with accessories but no prop ) ...



Would be a big turn around for me to go this way .. but am presently 'looking' at all possibilities ...!!



Cheers

Graham (TR1 # 80 )



.
[quote]
---

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sstearns2(at)yahoo.com
Guest
PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 11:38 am    Post subject: to those that still have matco brakes... Reply with quote
Hello,
 
I have carbon wings, cowl and control surfaces, a parallel valve IO-360, and a wood/composite prince prop and it weighs about 850 lbs. 
 
 If I were looking for the same performance as the subaru I'd buy a mid to high time O-235 and pull the cylinders and have the heads ported and put in high compression pistons.  You could get at least 130HP out of it.  I'd recommend lycon in CA for the head work and pistons. 
 
You could do the same with a 320 and get 180-190 HP.  My "180 HP" 360 did 227 HP on the test cell with ported heads and 10:1 pistons and some other minor stuff.  It's a great engine, but cooling it at high power has been a big project.
 
The 360 requires major cowl work for induction and increase cooling and it just bearly fits under the cowl.  I have about 1/8" on each side. 
 
Scott
 
 
--- On Mon, 1/10/11, Graham Brighton <gbrighton(at)skymesh.com.au> wrote:
From: Graham Brighton <gbrighton(at)skymesh.com.au>
Subject: Re: to those that still have matco brakes...
To: kis-list(at)matronics.com
Date: Monday, January 10, 2011, 3:16 AM

Hey there Scott,
                              I have the Matco brakes ..so thx will check out the 'kit' ...  Back last April while test flying a rebuilt Subaru transplant ..a inlet valve head broke off and caused a forced landing ....have since been hung up with finding an engine build shop that i'm confidant with .. to build another Subaru engine  that i'd fly behind ......Am looking at a mid time IO-360 .... Can u tell me the weight of urs (all up complete with accessories but no prop )  ...
 
Would be a big turn around for me to go this way .. but am presently 'looking' at all possibilities ...!!
 
Cheers
Graham  (TR1 # 80 )
 

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wschertz(at)comcast.net
Guest
PostPosted: Tue Jan 11, 2011 10:10 pm    Post subject: to those that still have matco brakes... Reply with quote
It cost $443 for the changes. Is this a discount? I don’t know what a whole new set from Grove would cost, probably more – and I already had the Matco system installed.

Bill Schertz
KIS Cruiser #4045
N343BS
Phase I testing

From: John Forster
Sent: Monday, January 10, 2011 9:40 AM
To: kis-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RE: to those that still have matco brakes...

Bill,



Did they offer some discount for the upgrade process? I am still leaning toward replacing everything with Grove, but I am interested in the positive changes that Matco made.



And congrats on the testing milestone!



John


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: owner-kis-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-kis-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bill Schertz
Sent: Monday, January 10, 2011 9:27 AM
To: kis-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: to those that still have matco brakes...



I have a TR-4, that came with Matco Brakes. At first start-up and taxi, the braking action was very poor, and uneven. I could not turn right. Diagnosis revealed that one caliper had leaked, contaminating the surface. I cleaned that up, and it was ‘better’ but still not good. Did the exercise of pulling the plane and riding the brakes to ‘burn them in’ and that helped quite a bit.



Found that one caliper was still leaking, so contacted Matco.



Turns out that they had been bought out by a new owner since my original brakes were made. several changes were available.

1. a larger caliper cylinders

2. a more aggressive brake pad, and

3. they changed the material that the rotor was made of , and when I removed my calipers to send them back to be retrofit, I found that one of the rotors had a crack in it. Discussion with Matco revealed that the original rotors (which I had) were made from an easily machined material that contained graphitic carbon (which can act as a lubricant – good for machining and bad for braking), and the new rotors were made of a different alloy. Bottom line – I upgraded the caliper cylinders, and the rotors.



I have great braking now. Will hold the plane at full throttle on the ground (if the tires don’t slide on the pavement). I paid attention to the geometry at the master cylinders from the Matco literature, and did not use the wimpy brake pedals that KIS supplied.



By the way, I completed my 40 hour test requirement yesterday.



Bill Schertz
KIS Cruiser #4045
N343BS

From: Graham Brighton

Sent: Monday, January 10, 2011 5:16 AM

To: kis-list(at)matronics.com

Subject: Re: to those that still have matco brakes...



Hey there Scott,

I have the Matco brakes ..so thx will check out the 'kit' ... Back last April while test flying a rebuilt Subaru transplant ..a inlet valve head broke off and caused a forced landing ....have since been hung up with finding an engine build shop that i'm confidant with .. to build another Subaru engine that i'd fly behind ......Am looking at a mid time IO-360 .... Can u tell me the weight of urs (all up complete with accessories but no prop ) ...



Would be a big turn around for me to go this way .. but am presently 'looking' at all possibilities ...!!



Cheers

Graham (TR1 # 80 )

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