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 Posted: Mon Aug 24, 2015 11:22 am Post subject: TeamGrumman-List Digest: 3 Msgs - 08/22/15 |
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Well said, Gary. Customers are, indeed, an interesting lot!
Bert
On Aug 22, 2015, at 9:03 PM, TeamGrumman-List Digest Server wrote:
| Quote: | *
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TeamGrumman-List Digest Archive
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Total Messages Posted Sat 08/22/15: 3
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Today's Message Index:
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1. 10:51 AM - 1979 Tiger for sale. An update (Gary L Vogt)
2. 10:55 AM - 1979 Tiger for sale (Gary L Vogt)
3. 02:21 PM - Customers are an interesting lot (Gary L Vogt)
________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________
Time: 10:51:42 AM PST US
From: Gary L Vogt <teamgrumman(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: 1979 Tiger for sale. An update
There has been an overwhelming interest in this plane. 6 phone calls
and 3 emails. Questions were asked regarding a couple of things not in
the original post. They are marked with a *. Here it is again with
the update. The current owner sent me a lot of pics. Send me an email
and I=99ll send then to you.
--------------------------------------------------
One of my very good customers has decided it=99s time to sell. I
have been maintaining and upgrading this plane for 12 or 13 years
through two different owners. With paint and interior, this would be a
show plane. It has a lot of extras that you=99d have to pay for
if you bought a cheaper plane.
Here are the particulars.
1979 Gulfstream-American Tiger, SN 1188 (one of the last ones built.)
Purchased by the current owner in 2007 for $72,000.
He=99s asking $75,000. It=99s worth every cent.
TTAF: 2670
TTEngine: 2670
TSMOH: 915
TTProp: 2273
* Prop: Sensenich
TSPOH: 915
Vacuum Pump: 318
Elec Fuel Pump: 294
Carb: 851
Rudder Springs: 500
Equipment: Avionics
Garmin GMA 340
Garmin GNS 430W
Garmin GTX 327
Garmin 496 slaved to the GNS 430W
Apollo GX 60
JPI EDM 700 with fuel flow
* Century I autopilot
Airframe:
Jaguar Cowling.
new fiberglass dorsal fin
new fiberglass wheel pants
* New tail cone
Whelen combination tail strobe/Nav light
Flush rudder cap
* Damage History: In 2002 or 2003 the previous owner, Eddie, hit a
flock of starlings near Livermore. Post flight inspection revealed 13
hits. Most of the hits were to the nose bowl, prop, and windshield.
There were a couple of hits on the wings. I have been all over the
wings, inside and out, with mirrors and flashlights and I can see no
evidence of any repair. Whoever did the repair was a real craftsman.
Engine: Other
new Macfarlane throttle cable.
Interior:
Fiberglass eyebrow
* luminescent lighting
Included:
Bose A20 headset
Bose X noise canceling headsets (2)
SkyOx portable O2 w/2 canulas and a facemask.
________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________
Time: 10:55:37 AM PST US
From: Gary L Vogt <teamgrumman(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: 1979 Tiger for sale
Actually, if you are on Facebook, like the AuCountry Aviation Facebook page and
you can see all of the pics.
________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________
Time: 02:21:20 PM PST US
From: Gary L Vogt <teamgrumman(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Customers are an interesting lot
Or maybe I should say, people are an interesting lot.
Ive been working on other peoples planes for 30 years. All total, Ive worked on
over 300 different planes; including a Cessna 210, a Cessna 182, a Cessna 177,
a Cessna 175, a Cessna 172, 2 Mooney M20s, a Mooney 231, 2 Piper Comanches,
a Beech Musketeer, 3 different Beech Bonanzas, 2 Citabrias, a Piper Pacer and
a whole lot of Grummans. Ive had customers fly from as far away as Missouri
to get their plane worked on. We currently have about 40 customers from San Diego
to Seattle and as far east as Utah; about a tank of gas each way.
Ive learned a lot about people in 30 years.
Ive had customers who were poor day laborers scraping by just to fly, a retired
F-105 fighter who told great stories of sorties over Vietnam, a couple of F-16
fighter pilots, a Lt General in the California Air National Guard, several computer
engineers, several self employed house builders & property managers, a
couple of airport managers, owners of petroleum distributers, an Under Sheriff
for LA County, two architects, several Civil, Mechanical, Electrical, and Aerospace
engineers, several University Professors, a couple of High School teachers,
a retired surveyor for the State of California, a couple of California Fire
Fighters, a developer from Canada, several airline pilots, a couple of lawyers,
and many more than I can recall.
I had no idea how to charge for annuals when I started. The avionics guy in Lancaster
charged $50/hr so thats what I charged. That avionics guy and I are still
good friends. He charges $110/hr now and has more work than he knows what
to do with.
I started doing owner assisted annuals almost right from the beginning. It took
a while to figure out how to charge for owner assist. One customer, about 1992,
suggested I just charge for the time I am working on the plane and forget
the flat rate charge. I told him it would cost him more. He said it was worth
it. So, that is how I do it now.
While in Lancaster, I would set up my futon couch for out-of-town customers doing
an owner assisted annual. I could help them and it kept the cost of the annuals
down. I continued that service after I moved to Auburn. Oddly, Ive had
a couple of customers whod rather stay in a motel than sleep n a futon couch;
go figure. Now that I have a house with a spare room, we, my wife Clytie and
I, have hosted MANY customers. They are treated to home-cooked Philipino food
for dinner each night and home-cooked American breakfasts; the longest stay
was just over a week. We have a couple of customers who insist on treating us
to meals out.
Weve had customers buy us tools, wine, Scotch, plane tickets, pay $100/hr driving
time to their airports to work on their planes, pay a $1000 finders fee for
an airplane they bought when the seller was too cheap to pay the $5000 promised
they'd pay me to sell his plane and then changed their minds after the deal
(this has happened twice), customers who give my wife and I free trips, customers
who offer us room and board when we visit their neck-of-the-woods and Ive
had customers loan me money (as much as $10,000) to get me through some very
dry spells. In 2006, I had one customer (the Lt General) who threatened to stop
bringing his plane to me because I didnt charge for all the work I did; he
insisted on paying for every nut, screw, terminal end and every minute I worked
on his plane. Sometime around 1999, I flew to Prescott, Arizona to help a
customer who had a plane that wouldnt start and needed a starter; I did it for
free. Sometime around 2003, I had a customer with a broken rudder spring in
North Las Vegas. I flew over there and changed the springs in 115 degree temps
for the cost of fuel. These were customers who always went out of their way
to help me; it was the least I could do.
And, on the flip side, Ive had good customers who would load up their planes with
free water and goodies from my refrigerator just because. Ive had customers
who pay their bills on monthly installments and ask for discounts even after
Ive already discounted the invoice. Ive had customers who complain the bill
is too high or that is shouldnt take 20-40 hours to strip the fuel tank sealant
out of a wing and reseal it or that I overcharge for parts [note: I generally
sell at retail cost for everything]. The really expensive stuff I sell at or
near my cost and make money on the installation and yet, some customers still
complain.
Most, if not all, of our customers have became long term friends. In 30 years,
Ive only refused to work on 4 planes. Not because of the planes (except for
2-seaters. Ive refused many 2-seaters. I work on one 2-seater BECAUSE of the owner.
Hes a terrific guy.), but because of the owners. Quite frankly, Im too
busy to deal with customers who lack integrity, who second guess everything I
do, who question my ethics or the way I charge, or those owners I just dont like.
To all [well, most all] of my customers, past and present, you make my life worth
while. Thanks.
Gary
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