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Mauledriver(at)nc.rr.com
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 Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 6:13 pm Post subject: FYI update on NL Starter, rebuilt mags (and fresh plugs) |
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I was never happy with the light weight starter that shipped with the
Vans configured Lycoming. As others have reported, getting the first
blade to turn over always seemed in question. I have two batteries
which I can apply separately or together to the starter. Replacing the
light weight starter with NL starter made a world of difference. It
turns a bit slower but with authority. And though I always intend to use
both batts for the start, I accidentally did a 1 battery start today and
got the same slower but authoritative start. Confidence boosted -
Dollars well spent.
I also swapped out my original Slicks at 860 hours for rebuilts.
Everything was running fine but some recommend overhaul or replacement
at 500 hours. Though I didn't expect it, the engine runs noticeably
smoother (the old mags had just been timed before they were replaced so
the the comparison was meaningful). Again, confidence boosted - dollars
well spent.
Back at 700 hours I completed replacement of all the original plugs with
new ones (the final 5 of 12). The engine ran noticeably smoother and
possibly with more oomph. Up to that point, I had cleaned and gapped
the plugs at every Condition Inspection. Going forward, I plan to
change plugs at 500 to 600 hours.
Just FYI, YMMV.
---
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Kelly McMullen
Joined: 16 Apr 2008
Posts: 1188
Location: Sun Lakes AZ
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| Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 9:09 pm Post subject: FYI update on NL Starter, rebuilt mags (and fresh plugs) |
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The standard recommendation on conventional mags is to inspect and repair as necessary at 500 hours, overhaul at 1000 hours. However pricing of parts for Slicks tends to lead to lead to replacement rather than overhaul, or to only do one overhaul. Normal massive plugs usually have worn the electrodes thin enough that they should be replaced at 400-500 hours. Not to mention that Champions tend to have a fair number reach excessive resistance at less than 400 hours. I've had one fail already with less than 100 hour....resistance at 7.5K ohms. High resistance plugs will be somewhat intermittent and stress the mags because a higher voltage is needed to create the spark.
-sent from the I-droid implanted in my forearm
On Sun, Apr 23, 2017 at 7:12 PM, Bill Watson <Mauledriver(at)nc.rr.com (Mauledriver(at)nc.rr.com)> wrote:
| Quote: | --> RV10-List message posted by: Bill Watson <Mauledriver(at)nc.rr.com (Mauledriver(at)nc.rr.com)>
I was never happy with the light weight starter that shipped with the Vans configured Lycoming. As others have reported, getting the first blade to turn over always seemed in question. I have two batteries which I can apply separately or together to the starter. Replacing the light weight starter with NL starter made a world of difference. It turns a bit slower but with authority. And though I always intend to use both batts for the start, I accidentally did a 1 battery start today and got the same slower but authoritative start. Confidence boosted - Dollars well spent.
I also swapped out my original Slicks at 860 hours for rebuilts. Everything was running fine but some recommend overhaul or replacement at 500 hours. Though I didn't expect it, the engine runs noticeably smoother (the old mags had just been timed before they were replaced so the the comparison was meaningful). Again, confidence boosted - dollars well spent.
Back at 700 hours I completed replacement of all the original plugs with new ones (the final 5 of 12). The engine ran noticeably smoother and possibly with more oomph. Up to that point, I had cleaned and gapped the plugs at every Condition Inspection. Going forward, I plan to change plugs at 500 to 600 hours.
Just FYI, YMMV.
---
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Kelly McMullen
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Kelly McMullen
Joined: 16 Apr 2008
Posts: 1188
Location: Sun Lakes AZ
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| Posted: Mon Apr 24, 2017 5:42 am Post subject: FYI update on NL Starter, rebuilt mags (and fresh plugs) |
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OK, so if Champion has "fixed" the problem, why would a CSOB RV builder choose to spend $4 more per massive plug, or $24 more per fine wire plug the buy the C brand over the T brand?? They also have shown problems with their fine wire plugs in turbo-charged and turbo-normalized engines, such that GAMI/Tornado Alley Turbos issued a service bulletin to not use Champion fine wires. (ceramic around center electrodes were cracking and failing) I don't know if it could be a problem or not with normally aspirated engines running higher than stock compression.
I just don't know what would compel making a switch back to Champion.
-sent from the I-droid implanted in my forearm
On Mon, Apr 24, 2017 at 6:05 AM, bill.peyton <peyton.b(at)sbcglobal.net (peyton.b(at)sbcglobal.net)> wrote:
| Quote: | --> RV10-List message posted by: "bill.peyton" <peyton.b(at)sbcglobal.net (peyton.b(at)sbcglobal.net)>
Champion plugs used to be manufactured with a resistive element that was inserted into the center of the plug and held in place with a spring and a screw cap. This design was flawed and allowed the assembly to fail over time from either the contact resistance increasing or the spring tension failing. The result was an excessive amount of series resistance through the plug. On several occasions this assembly has failed by opening up and then taking out a magneto with it. When the resistor opens up, the magneto starts to arc internally.
The Tempest plug has an internal resistor that is integral to the assembly and is bonded in place. Champion has redesigned their plug in a similar manner to eliminate the aforementioned problem.
You can identify the old plug design by looking into the center section. You will see a screw cap that can be removed with a conventional screw driver.
--------
Bill
WA0SYV
Aviation Partners, LLC
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Kelly McMullen
A&P/IA, EAA Tech Counselor
KCHD |
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Kelly McMullen
Joined: 16 Apr 2008
Posts: 1188
Location: Sun Lakes AZ
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| Posted: Mon Apr 24, 2017 6:07 pm Post subject: FYI update on NL Starter, rebuilt mags (and fresh plugs) |
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Economics are such that you only come out ahead if all of your fine wires make it to TBO. Drop one, have it develop high resistance or break an electrode, and you come out about even with having massives. I've seen them dropped, I've had Champion fine wires develop resistance of over 100K. So far haven't broken an electrode, but I know it is easy to do. If a cylinder is using some oil, fine wire on bottom plug might make sense, but an REM37BY does same thing for 1/3 the money.
-sent from the I-droid implanted in my forearm
On Mon, Apr 24, 2017 at 1:36 PM, Tim Olson <Tim(at)myrv10.com (Tim(at)myrv10.com)> wrote:
| Quote: | --> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim(at)MyRV10.com>
Or, just use Fine wire plugs. I'm guessing those will run to TBO
with minimal issues. They won't have electrode erosion, so if
they are replaced early, it will likely be for some other purpose.
Tim
On 4/24/2017 1:02 PM, Bill Watson wrote:
| Quote: | I was replacing plugs as needed through 700 hours due to electrode
erosion and then just replaced the remaining units at 700. Going
forward when 1 or 2 need replacement, I'll probably just do the whole set.
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Kelly McMullen
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