Matronics Email Lists :: View topic - Switches and Breakers

Matronics Email Lists
Web Forum Interface to the Matronics Email Lists

Get Email Distribution Too! FAQ Search Memberlist Usergroups Register

Profile Log in to check your private messages Log in

Switches and Breakers

Matronics Email Lists Forum Index -> AeroElectric-List

View previous topic :: View next topic

Author Message

nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelect
Guest

Posted: Fri May 05, 2017 3:41 am Post subject: Switches and Breakers

At 08:36 PM 5/4/2017, you wrote:

  	  Quote: 	
		   I agree in spirit, BUT I recently ran into an issue where the procedure for handling an ignition system failure indication, is to pull the ignition system breaker while the engine is running.Â  This is not a situation where the manufacture and myself would not want a switch. 	


     "Failure indications" are not normal

     operations . . . and yes, crew are

     sometimes advised to pull breakers

     for duration of flight as response to

     a failure; implementing Plan-B for

     comfortable termination of flight.



     But I'm curious as to the design of

     any ignition system that is not effectively

     shut down by simply turning it off.

     Was the pulling of a breaker intended

     to 'reset' the failure or was the

     breaker pulled to prevent a malfunctioning

     ignition from causing more mischief

     even tho it was commanded OFF by normal

     positioning of controls?



     I'm aware of no electronic ignition

     system offered to the OBAM aviation

     market that would require such an

     action . . . setting the panel control

     to OFF does what the label implies.



     Do you recall what make/model of ignition

     system suggested this procedure? Was

     it to 'reset' the light or simply

     disable the system for duration

     of the flight?



 



 

   Bob . . .

neil(at)rosoff.com
Guest

Posted: Fri May 05, 2017 6:50 am Post subject: Switches and Breakers

The plane is a Twin Commander with TPE 331-10s.   The specific failure  is the 50% speed switch.  There are 4 or 5 operational items that happened at that time.   If any one of them fail the ignition indication will remain on.   Resetting the breaker will reset all of the thing that happen at 50%.  Interestingly enough this procedure was "Tribal Knowledge" on my model,  the next model the procedure was documented in the POH.



Neil Rosoff



On May 5, 2017, at 7:39 AM, Robert L. Nuckolls, III <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com (nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com)> wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		    At 08:36 PM 5/4/2017, you wrote:

  	  Quote: 	
		   I agree in spirit, BUT I recently ran into an issue where the procedure for handling an ignition system failure indication, is to pull the ignition system breaker while the engine is running.Ã‚  This is not a situation where the manufacture and myself would not want a switch. 	


     "Failure indications" are not normal

     operations . . . and yes, crew are

     sometimes advised to pull breakers

     for duration of flight as response to

     a failure; implementing Plan-B for

     comfortable termination of flight.



     But I'm curious as to the design of

     any ignition system that is not effectively

     shut down by simply turning it off.

     Was the pulling of a breaker intended

     to 'reset' the failure or was the

     breaker pulled to prevent a malfunctioning

     ignition from causing more mischief

     even tho it was commanded OFF by normal

     positioning of controls?



     I'm aware of no electronic ignition

     system offered to the OBAM aviation

     market that would require such an

     action . . . setting the panel control

     to OFF does what the label implies.



     Do you recall what make/model of ignition

     system suggested this procedure? Was

     it to 'reset' the light or simply

     disable the system for duration

     of the flight?



 



 

   Bob . . .

jim(at)PoogieBearRanch.co
Guest

Posted: Fri May 05, 2017 12:16 pm Post subject: Switches and Breakers

OK - I give up. 



I cannot find the meaning of "OBAM" anywhere, but I see it used

frequently in this list. What does it mean? 



Thank you.



Jim Parker



  ------

harleydixon

Joined: 17 Sep 2016
Posts: 18
Location: Henrietta, NY

Posted: Fri May 05, 2017 12:27 pm Post subject: Switches and Breakers

I once had the same question...Had me guessing for awhile as       well.

          

Owner Built And Maintained!     

Harley

          

     On 5/5/2017 4:14 PM,       jim(at)PoogieBearRanch.com (jim(at)PoogieBearRanch.com) wrote:

     

      	  Quote: 	
		          	  Quote: 	
		  --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: <jim(at)poogiebearranch.com> (jim(at)poogiebearranch.com)



OK - I give up. 



I cannot find the meaning of "OBAM" anywhere, but I see it used

frequently in this list. What does it mean? 



Thank you.



Jim Parker

_________________
Harley Dixon

Long EZ N28EZ
Canandaigua Airport (D38)
Canandaigua, NY

cluros(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Fri May 05, 2017 12:28 pm Post subject: Switches and Breakers

I always thought Owner Built And Maintained.

On Fri, May 5, 2017 at 1:14 PM,  <jim(at)poogiebearranch.com (jim(at)poogiebearranch.com)> wrote:

[quote]--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: <jim(at)poogiebearranch.com (jim(at)poogiebearranch.com)>

 

 OK - I give up.

 

 I cannot find the meaning of "OBAM" anywhere, but I see it used

 frequently in this list. What does it mean?

 

 Thank you.

 

 Jim Parker

 

 

 

 Â  ------

ngeorge(at)cmg.aero
Guest

Posted: Fri May 05, 2017 12:32 pm Post subject: Switches and Breakers

OBAM

Owner Build And Maintained aircraft



neal



--

JohnCiolino(at)carolina.r
Guest

Posted: Fri May 05, 2017 1:17 pm Post subject: Switches and Breakers

Jim,



It's an acronym for "Owner Built And Maintained"



John



--

nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelect
Guest

Posted: Fri May 05, 2017 3:17 pm Post subject: Switches and Breakers

At 04:15 PM 5/5/2017, you wrote:

  	  Quote: 	
		  --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "John Ciolino" <JohnCiolino(at)carolina.rr.com>



 Jim,



 It's an acronym for "Owner Built And Maintained" 	


   I coined the phrase many moons ago after

   having worked decades with one foot in

   TC aircraft, the other in 'experimental'

   aircraft.



   While 'experimental' is the official

   designation for giving a builder something

   that amounts to a permanent, unbounded

   ferry permit, I thought the term inadequate

   and misleading. While we are indeed free to

   EVOLVE our aircraft, the vast majority of what

   gets licensed every year is anything but

   and experiment.



   The OBAM aircraft industry has at least

   met and perhaps surpassed the quality,

   utility and reliability of the TC

   aircraft.  I am loath to debase our

   craft with a term that does not comport

   with reality.



 

 

   Bob . . .

nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelect
Guest

Posted: Sat May 06, 2017 6:37 am Post subject: Switches and Breakers

At 09:48 AM 5/5/2017, you wrote:

  	  Quote: 	
		  The plane is a Twin Commander with TPE 331-10s.   The specific failure  is the 50% speed switch.  There are 4 or 5 operational items that happened at that time.   If any one of them fail the ignition indication will remain on.   Resetting the breaker will reset all of the thing that happen at 50%.  Interestingly enough this procedure was "Tribal Knowledge" on my model,  the next model the procedure was documented in the POH. 	


   Hmmmm . . . yeah, there are probably dozens

   of examples for what my bosses would have called

   a 'work around' for relatively minor deficiencies

   in system FEMA.



   The condition you cited was probably not discovered

   before the system was holy-watered for production.

   As a general rule on new designs, we were chartered

   not to rely on crew management of input power by

   cycling power to a bus or pulling a breaker.



   To be sure, there have been instances

   where the practice did find its way into

   the cockpit but the work around could only be

   applied in low pucker-factor situations.



   Finding and operating the right breaker in a

   sea of little black knobs with lights flashing,

   bells going off or captain giving tense orders

   was problematic at best. We just didn't do

   it.



   On our airplanes, such a condition is EASY to

   fix . . . on airplanes with TCs . . . not so much.



 

 

   Bob . . .

efraim.otero(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Sat May 06, 2017 8:31 pm Post subject: Switches and Breakers

Neal:

Wouldn't that be

OBAMA?

ðŸ˜‚ðŸ¤£



Sent from my iPhone



[quote] On May 5, 2017, at 3:31 PM, Neal George <ngeorge(at)cmg.aero> wrote:

 

 

 

 OBAM

 Owner Build And Maintained aircraft

 

 neal

 

 --

billhuntersemail(at)gmail
Guest

Posted: Sat May 06, 2017 9:11 pm Post subject: Switches and Breakers

 	  Quote: 	
		   Wouldn't that be OBAMA?


	


Chirp...chirp...chirp...no response to your joke for some reason Neal...



Ouch...folks are still sore I guess...



:  )     <  ------  CJII (Cyber Joke Indicator Icon)

.



Cheers!!!



Bill  Hunter





--

Robert Reed

Joined: 22 Oct 2009
Posts: 331
Location: Dallas/Ft.Worth

Posted: Sun May 07, 2017 4:30 am Post subject: Switches and Breakers

Only if they were intended to Always Crash and Burn. 



Bob Reed

Sent from my iPhone



[quote] On May 6, 2017, at 11:29 PM, Efraim Otero <efraim.otero(at)gmail.com> wrote:

 

 

 

 Neal:

 Wouldn't that be

 OBAMA?

 ðŸ˜‚ðŸ¤£

 

 Sent from my iPhone

 

> On May 5, 2017, at 3:31 PM, Neal George <ngeorge(at)cmg.aero> wrote:

> 

> 

> 

> OBAM

> Owner Build And Maintained aircraft

> 

> neal

> 

> --

neal.george(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Sun May 07, 2017 5:35 am Post subject: Switches and Breakers

Oh hell!

Words escape me. 

Mea culpa



Neal George

Sent from my iPhone



On May 7, 2017, at 7:28 AM, Robert Reed <robertr237(at)att.net> wrote:






Only if they were intended to Always Crash and Burn. 



Bob Reed

Sent from my iPhone



[quote] On May 6, 2017, at 11:29 PM, Efraim Otero <efraim.otero(at)gmail.com> wrote:

 

 

 

 Neal:

 Wouldn't that be

 OBAMA?

 ðŸ˜‚ðŸ¤£

 

 Sent from my iPhone

 

> On May 5, 2017, at 3:31 PM, Neal George <ngeorge(at)cmg.aero> wrote:

> 

> 

> 

> OBAM

> Owner Build And Maintained aircraft

> 

> neal

> 

> --

ceengland7(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Sun May 07, 2017 7:01 am Post subject: Switches and Breakers

1st, politics are not the subject of this list.

2nd, do you really want to go there, Vladimir?

On 5/7/2017 7:28 AM, Robert Reed wrote:

[quote] 

 Only if they were intended to Always Crash and Burn.

 Bob Reed

 Sent from my iPhone

> On May 6, 2017, at 11:29 PM, Efraim Otero <efraim.otero(at)gmail.com> wrote:

>

> 

>

> Neal:

> Wouldn't that be

> OBAMA?

> ðŸ˜‚ðŸ¤£

>

> Sent from my iPhone

>

>> On May 5, 2017, at 3:31 PM, Neal George <ngeorge(at)cmg.aero> wrote:

>>

>> 

>>

>> OBAM

>> Owner Build And Maintained aircraft

>>

>> neal

>>

>> --

Display posts from previous:

	Matronics Email Lists Forum Index -> AeroElectric-List	All times are GMT - 8 Hours
Page 1 of 1

Jump to:

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum