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Ice prevention on fuel vent
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rene(at)felker.com
Guest





PostPosted: Fri Nov 24, 2017 8:44 am    Post subject: Ice prevention on fuel vent Reply with quote

No expert here….if you do encounter icing check out the fuel tank drain when you get on the ground.  I do not remember seeing any on the vent tube, was not looking, just noted a large chunk on the fuel drain. 

Rene'
801-721-6080


From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Carlos Trigo
Sent: Friday, November 24, 2017 9:29 AM
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RE: Re: Ice prevention on fuel vent

By the way, Tim and all the experts in this forum

If the conditions create ice in the tip of the tube (which is in the air stream), why does it nor create ice inside the wing cavity as well?
Is it because the ice is created not only by the air temperature, but also by the positive dynamic pressure in the vent tube tip?

Wondering minds want to know …

Thanks
Carlos

De: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com) [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com)] Em nome de Tim Olson
Enviada: Friday, November 24, 2017 1:02 PM
Para: rv10-list(at)matronics.com (rv10-list(at)matronics.com)
Assunto: Re: Re: Ice prevention on fuel vent

I should have read again before replying... darn.

That check valve will work fine, as would any free flow valve, but, the other down side is your fuel vents are 1/4” tubing and that particular valve uses 3/8” fittings, so you will need to buy additional adapters to fit it in, which may require a little more creativity in mounting. At $27.50 it isn’t super cheap either but looks like good quality. I don’t remember what I paid, but it would be worth checking out what other valves you can find because if you can find one that is 1/8” NPT it may be easier to adapt. That said, mine is brass and is probably heavier than this one is too.

Tim
On Nov 24, 2017, at 3:53 AM, Carlos Trigo <trigo(at)mail.telepac.pt (trigo(at)mail.telepac.pt)> wrote:
Quote:

Tim


In the Q+A for this ACS valve, at the Aircraft Spruce website, it says that this valve breakout pressure is 0 psi.

Will this work for this application?



Carlos
Enviado do meu iPhone
No dia 24/11/2017, às 05:12, Tim Olson <Tim(at)MyRV10.com (Tim(at)MyRV10.com)> escreveu:
Quote:

Regarding that check valve...I just got around to looking at the link on this
Aircraft Spruce one, Phil.

I know you want one with a very very very low operating pressure (vacuum, actually).
If you get even a couple of psi that it takes to open the valve, your tank will
have probably imploded by then. This valve appears to be for fuel flow
return lines. It doesn't seem to give a spec.

I got a valve from McMaster Carr that had a cracking pressure of .3 psi.

http://www.myrv10.com/N104CD/upgrades/20090525/index.html

I can't say that the valve you linked to is bad, but I would just caution to
make sure that it's probably no more than 1psi of cracking pressure.
Any valve that takes more than that to operate may risk tank
collapse.

Tim
On 11/23/2017 7:20 AM, Phillip Perry wrote:
Quote:

Here you go Dave..


http://m.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/acscheckvalve.php?clickkey=6903




Sent from my iPhone
On Nov 23, 2017, at 3:57 AM, rvdave <rv610dave(at)gmail.com (rv610dave(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
Quote:

--> RV10-List message posted by: "rvdave" <rv610dave(at)gmail.com (rv610dave(at)gmail.com)>

I’ve been looking for a check valve where can you get one with low psi?

--------
Dave Ford
RV6 for sale
RV10 building
Cadillac, MI


Read this topic online here:

http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=475455#475455
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Tim Olson



Joined: 25 Jan 2007
Posts: 2760

PostPosted: Fri Nov 24, 2017 8:56 am    Post subject: Ice prevention on fuel vent Reply with quote

That's an easy one. The ice comes from direct contact with the
moisture in the air, not just because it's cold out. There
may be bits of liquid that DO get in the wing cavity during
flight, if you're in actual liquid rain, and those could freeze,
but it's unlikely that anything significant would get thru the
cracks if you're just talking cloud vapor.
With supercooled water, it will freeze on contact and my guess
is that even if you hit that while flying, it would freeze before it
would get significantly far into the wing cavity, maybe even
sealing the cracks it flows into.

But, all of the icing is from moisture, not air temp.
Tim
On 11/24/2017 10:28 AM, Carlos Trigo wrote:
Quote:
By the way, Tim and all the experts in this forum

If the conditions create ice in the tip of the tube (which is in the air
stream), why does it nor create ice inside the wing cavity as well?

Is it because the ice is created not only by the air temperature, but
also by the positive dynamic pressure in the vent tube tip?

Wondering minds want to know …

Thanks

Carlos

*De:*owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] *Em nome de *Tim Olson
*Enviada:* Friday, November 24, 2017 1:02 PM
*Para:* rv10-list(at)matronics.com
*Assunto:* Re: Re: Ice prevention on fuel vent

I should have read again before replying... darn.

That check valve will work fine, as would any free flow valve, but, the
other down side is your fuel vents are 1/4” tubing and that particular
valve uses 3/8” fittings, so you will need to buy additional adapters to
fit it in, which may require a little more creativity in mounting.  At
$27.50 it isn’t super cheap either but looks like good quality. I don’t
remember what I paid, but it would be worth checking out what other
valves you can find because if you can find one that is 1/8” NPT it may
be easier to adapt.  That said, mine is brass and is probably heavier
than this one is too.

Tim


On Nov 24, 2017, at 3:53 AM, Carlos Trigo <trigo(at)mail.telepac.pt
<mailto:trigo(at)mail.telepac.pt>> wrote:

Tim

In the Q+A for this ACS valve, at the Aircraft Spruce website, it
says that this valve breakout pressure is 0 psi.

Will this work for this application?

Carlos

Enviado do meu iPhone


No dia 24/11/2017, às 05:12, Tim Olson <Tim(at)MyRV10.com
<mailto:Tim(at)MyRV10.com>> escreveu:

Regarding that check valve...I just got around to looking at the
link on this
Aircraft Spruce one, Phil.

I know you want one with a very very very low operating pressure
(vacuum, actually).
If you get even a couple of psi that it takes to open the valve,
your tank will
have probably imploded by then.   This valve appears to be for
fuel flow
return lines.  It doesn't seem to give a spec.

I got a valve from McMaster Carr that had a cracking pressure of
.3 psi.

http://www.myrv10.com/N104CD/upgrades/20090525/index.html

I can't say that the valve you linked to is bad, but I would
just caution to
make sure that it's probably no more than 1psi of cracking pressure.
Any valve that takes more than that to operate may risk tank
collapse.

Tim


On 11/23/2017 7:20 AM, Phillip Perry wrote:

Here you go Dave..

http://m.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/acscheckvalve.php?clickkey=6903

Sent from my iPhone


On Nov 23, 2017, at 3:57 AM, rvdave <rv610dave(at)gmail.com
<mailto:rv610dave(at)gmail.com>> wrote:


<rv610dave(at)gmail.com <mailto:rv610dave(at)gmail.com>>

I’ve been looking for a check valve where can you get
one with low psi?

--------
Dave Ford
RV6 for sale
RV10 building
Cadillac, MI




Read this topic online here:

http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=475455#475455


<===========================sp; -->
htt==========================;           - MATRONI;
<http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List>http://forums.matronics.com
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==========================bsp;        - List
Contribution Web S;                   -Matt Dralle, List
Admin.
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kearney



Joined: 20 Sep 2008
Posts: 545

PostPosted: Fri Nov 24, 2017 3:31 pm    Post subject: Re: Ice prevention on fuel vent Reply with quote

Hi

I got two of these from amazon - McMaster Carr is difficult to use in Canada.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01A63WB70/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Specs say cracking pressure is about 1/2 PSIG

Cheers

Les


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gengrumpy



Joined: 07 May 2013
Posts: 124
Location: Tullahoma, TN

PostPosted: Fri Nov 24, 2017 6:08 pm    Post subject: Ice prevention on fuel vent Reply with quote

In addition to the Van’s recommended small hole drilled on the back side of the line just above the end of the vent line, why not drill the same diameter hole in the tubing underneath the wing fairing, giving a second possible relief should the vent tube opening get plugged??
grumpy
Quote:
On Nov 24, 2017, at 7:02 AM, Tim Olson <Tim(at)MyRV10.com (Tim(at)MyRV10.com)> wrote:

I should have read again before replying... darn.
That check valve will work fine, as would any free flow valve, but, the other down side is your fuel vents are 1/4” tubing and that particular valve uses 3/8” fittings, so you will need to buy additional adapters to fit it in, which may require a little more creativity in mounting. At $27.50 it isn’t super cheap either but looks like good quality. I don’t remember what I paid, but it would be worth checking out what other valves you can find because if you can find one that is 1/8” NPT it may be easier to adapt. That said, mine is brass and is probably heavier than this one is too.
Tim
On Nov 24, 2017, at 3:53 AM, Carlos Trigo <trigo(at)mail.telepac.pt (trigo(at)mail.telepac.pt)> wrote:
Quote:
Tim
In the Q+A for this ACS valve, at the Aircraft Spruce website, it says that this valve breakout pressure is 0 psi.
Will this work for this application?

CarlosEnviado do meu iPhone
No dia 24/11/2017, às 05:12, Tim Olson <Tim(at)MyRV10.com (Tim(at)MyRV10.com)> escreveu:
Quote:
Regarding that check valve...I just got around to looking at the link on this Aircraft Spruce one, Phil. I know you want one with a very very very low operating pressure (vacuum, actually). If you get even a couple of psi that it takes to open the valve, your tank will have probably imploded by then. This valve appears to be for fuel flow return lines. It doesn't seem to give a spec. I got a valve from McMaster Carr that had a cracking pressure of .3 psi. http://www.myrv10.com/N104CD/upgrades/20090525/index.html I can't say that the valve you linked to is bad, but I would just caution to make sure that it's probably no more than 1psi of cracking pressure. Any valve that takes more than that to operate may risk tank collapse. Tim On 11/23/2017 7:20 AM, Phillip Perry wrote:
Quote:
Here you go Dave..
http://m.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/acscheckvalve.php?clickkey=6903

Sent from my iPhone
On Nov 23, 2017, at 3:57 AM, rvdave <rv610dave(at)gmail.com (rv610dave(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
Quote:
--> RV10-List message posted by: "rvdave" <rv610dave(at)gmail.com (rv610dave(at)gmail.com)> I’ve been looking for a check valve where can you get one with low psi? -------- Dave Ford RV6 for sale RV10 building Cadillac, MI Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=475455#475455 <===========================sp; --> htt==========================; - MATRONI; http://forums.matronics.com http://wiki.matronics.com =bsp; - List Contribution Web S; -Matt Dralle, List Admin. <===============================









- The Matronics RV10-List Email Forum -
 

Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:

http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
Back to top
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parish(at)parishmoffitt.c
Guest





PostPosted: Sat Nov 25, 2017 4:56 am    Post subject: Ice prevention on fuel vent Reply with quote

Anything sticking out into  the airflow will accumulate ice when in “icing conditions” and “icing conditions” can occur at a temperature higher than you would think. On airplanes that fly in the ice all the time, one of the common ways we evaluate the severity is to look for something small sticking out into the airstream (like the safety wire on the windshield wipers).

Parish

From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rene
Sent: Friday, November 24, 2017 11:43 AM
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RE: Re: Ice prevention on fuel vent

No expert here….if you do encounter icing check out the fuel tank drain when you get on the ground. I do not remember seeing any on the vent tube, was not looking, just noted a large chunk on the fuel drain.

Rene'
801-721-6080


From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com) [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com)] On Behalf Of Carlos Trigo
Sent: Friday, November 24, 2017 9:29 AM
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com (rv10-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: RE: Re: Ice prevention on fuel vent

By the way, Tim and all the experts in this forum

If the conditions create ice in the tip of the tube (which is in the air stream), why does it nor create ice inside the wing cavity as well?
Is it because the ice is created not only by the air temperature, but also by the positive dynamic pressure in the vent tube tip?

Wondering minds want to know …

Thanks
Carlos

De: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com) [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com)] Em nome de Tim Olson
Enviada: Friday, November 24, 2017 1:02 PM
Para: rv10-list(at)matronics.com (rv10-list(at)matronics.com)
Assunto: Re: Re: Ice prevention on fuel vent

I should have read again before replying... darn.

That check valve will work fine, as would any free flow valve, but, the other down side is your fuel vents are 1/4” tubing and that particular valve uses 3/8” fittings, so you will need to buy additional adapters to fit it in, which may require a little more creativity in mounting. At $27.50 it isn’t super cheap either but looks like good quality. I don’t remember what I paid, but it would be worth checking out what other valves you can find because if you can find one that is 1/8” NPT it may be easier to adapt. That said, mine is brass and is probably heavier than this one is too.

Tim
On Nov 24, 2017, at 3:53 AM, Carlos Trigo <trigo(at)mail.telepac.pt (trigo(at)mail.telepac.pt)> wrote:
Quote:

Tim


In the Q+A for this ACS valve, at the Aircraft Spruce website, it says that this valve breakout pressure is 0 psi.

Will this work for this application?



Carlos
Enviado do meu iPhone
No dia 24/11/2017, às 05:12, Tim Olson <Tim(at)MyRV10.com (Tim(at)MyRV10.com)> escreveu:
Quote:

Regarding that check valve...I just got around to looking at the link on this
Aircraft Spruce one, Phil.

I know you want one with a very very very low operating pressure (vacuum, actually).
If you get even a couple of psi that it takes to open the valve, your tank will
have probably imploded by then. This valve appears to be for fuel flow
return lines. It doesn't seem to give a spec.

I got a valve from McMaster Carr that had a cracking pressure of .3 psi.

http://www.myrv10.com/N104CD/upgrades/20090525/index.html

I can't say that the valve you linked to is bad, but I would just caution to
make sure that it's probably no more than 1psi of cracking pressure.
Any valve that takes more than that to operate may risk tank
collapse.

Tim
On 11/23/2017 7:20 AM, Phillip Perry wrote:
Quote:

Here you go Dave..


http://m.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/acscheckvalve.php?clickkey=6903




Sent from my iPhone
On Nov 23, 2017, at 3:57 AM, rvdave <rv610dave(at)gmail.com (rv610dave(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
Quote:

--> RV10-List message posted by: "rvdave" <rv610dave(at)gmail.com (rv610dave(at)gmail.com)>

I’ve been looking for a check valve where can you get one with low psi?

--------
Dave Ford
RV6 for sale
RV10 building
Cadillac, MI


Read this topic online here:

http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=475455#475455
<===========================sp; --> htt==========================; - MATRONI; http://forums.matronics.com
http://wiki.matronics.com
==========================bsp; - List Contribution Web S; -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
<===============================







- The Matronics RV10-List Email Forum -
 

Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:

http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
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