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XS Fuel Tank Kiwi Mod
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asarangan(at)gmail.com
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 29, 2014 7:42 am    Post subject: XS Fuel Tank Kiwi Mod Reply with quote

Your cradle idea is a good one. I am doing something similar right now.
One thing I noticed with your setup is that the tank could potentially
pivot and tip forward under weight. The cradle may need an additional
support at the forward end.
In my case, I am bonding the cradle to both bulkheads (seat back and
baggage bay), creating a sturdy raised floor for the tank to rest on.
Like yours, I also have lateral and fore-aft support to hold the tank
in place. I don't have pictures yet, but will have some soon.

On Sat, Mar 29, 2014 at 5:07 AM, spcialeffects <spcialeffects(at)aol.com> wrote:
Quote:


I copied this idea from someone else, think i saw it on the europa org site so all credit to them.


Read this topic online here:

http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=421233#421233


Attachments:

http://forums.matronics.com//files/swollen_tank_161.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/cradle_lay_up_208.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/trimed_and_ready_122.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/gap_behind_tank_165.jpg



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Fred Klein



Joined: 26 Mar 2012
Posts: 503

PostPosted: Sat Mar 29, 2014 4:49 pm    Post subject: XS Fuel Tank Kiwi Mod Reply with quote

On Mar 29, 2014, at 9:11 AM, William Daniell <wdaniell.longport(at)gmail.com (wdaniell.longport(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
Quote:
My tank dates from 2003. Everything is in and I am planning to close the fuselage. I have understood that once filled (except for the comments about the aux tank) with fuel it's better to leave the tank full.
However I would like to check the fuel system for two reasons, one to check that it all works and the other is that if it does split I am thinking that the major surgery will be easier without the top on.
Is it a good idea to do this before closure bearing in mind that it will take be another 18 months (ha!) before flying?....or should I just hope for the best?


Will,
FWIW, I pondered the same question…in my case, the problems w/ the fuel tank arose after I’d bonded my CM into the canoe.
I reasoned first that all Europas were not experiencing the leaks in the fuel tank, and that the leaks were occurring after considerable flight times.
I concluded that the best way forward for me was to keep the tank dry until engine test / taxi trials and proceed w/ the build w/o delay. I also concluded that replacement of the tank, though a somewhat nasty process, would not be significantly different w/ or w/o the top on, and I am prepared to trouble-shoot the fuel system for leaks when I’m ready for engine tests.
Thus far, considering the passage of time and multiple hazards of having fuel in the aircraft during construction, I’m content w/ following this strategy. My only regret is my clear recollection of questioning the build manual’s instructions for bonding the tank into the CM, then NOT raising the issue for discussion on this forum, and telling myself “if it’s in the manual, it must be correct”.
Onward,
Fred
[quote][b]


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Duncan McFadyean



Joined: 18 Jan 2011
Posts: 218

PostPosted: Sun Mar 30, 2014 3:34 am    Post subject: XS Fuel Tank Kiwi Mod Reply with quote

To be clear, Ian Rickard's very useful drawing is not definitive to all variants; earlier tanks have a lesser volume, and the very first few were quite different and larger volume. Some of the latter may have been replaced during the build.

Duncan McF.




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PostPosted: Sun Mar 30, 2014 8:40 am    Post subject: XS Fuel Tank Kiwi Mod Reply with quote

Fred
yes....the idea of having fuel vapor around ...especially with my workshop (garage) ....
as for the fuel tank change...I think you're being optimistic I think it would be significantly easier without the top on but I don't see an alternative...you don't really what to do a major surgery for something that might never happen
Will

William Daniell

LONGPORT
+57 310 295 0744


On Sat, Mar 29, 2014 at 7:41 PM, Fred Klein <fklein(at)orcasonline.com (fklein(at)orcasonline.com)> wrote:
[quote]
On Mar 29, 2014, at 9:11 AM, William Daniell <wdaniell.longport(at)gmail.com (wdaniell.longport(at)gmail.com)> wrote:

Quote:
My tank dates from 2003. Everything is in and I am planning to close the fuselage. I have understood that once filled (except for the comments about the aux tank) with fuel it's better to leave the tank full.


However I would like to check the fuel system for two reasons, one to check that it all works and the other is that if it does split I am thinking that the major surgery will be easier without the top on.


Is it a good idea to do this before closure bearing in mind that it will take be another 18 months (ha!) before flying?....or should I just hope for the best?


Will,
FWIW, I pondered the same question&hellip;in my case, the problems w/ the fuel tank arose after I&rsquo;d bonded my CM into the canoe.
I reasoned first that all Europas were not experiencing the leaks in the fuel tank, and that the leaks were occurring after considerable flight times.


I concluded that the best way forward for me was to keep the tank dry until engine test / taxi trials and proceed w/ the build w/o delay. I also concluded that replacement of the tank, though a somewhat nasty process, would not be significantly different w/ or w/o the top on, and I am prepared to trouble-shoot the fuel system for leaks when I&rsquo;m ready for engine tests.


Thus far, considering the passage of time and multiple hazards of having fuel in the aircraft during construction, I&rsquo;m content w/ following this strategy. My only regret is my clear recollection of questioning the build manual&rsquo;s instructions for bonding the tank into the CM, then NOT raising the issue for discussion on this forum, and telling myself &ldquo;if it&rsquo;s in the manual, it must be correct&rdquo;.


Onward,
Fred
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arget="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List
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[b]


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Fred Klein



Joined: 26 Mar 2012
Posts: 503

PostPosted: Sun Mar 30, 2014 8:58 am    Post subject: XS Fuel Tank Kiwi Mod Reply with quote

On Mar 30, 2014, at 9:40 AM, William Daniell <wdaniell.longport(at)gmail.com (wdaniell.longport(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
Quote:
I think you're being optimistic I think it would be significantly easier without the top on but I don't see an alternative…


Will…I would never recommend building a Europa to anyone who was not an optimist…but, without wishing to tempt fate, consider the task of replacing tank w/ wings and doors off…IMO, t’would not be much different than w/ top off as well…Fred

[quote][b]


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rlborger(at)mac.com
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 30, 2014 9:54 am    Post subject: XS Fuel Tank Kiwi Mod Reply with quote

Gentlemen,

Having just replaced my fuel tank, I can speak to this issue. I did the replacement with doors on & wings off. There is one issue in fitting the new tank. The door sill on one side must be cut out to allow the new tank to go in:
[img]cid:90305085-EE13-46AC-952C-784C0463C387[/img]
[img]cid:BAD48C18-EDA4-4A84-B444-282ED12102FD[/img]
If the top were not on, this cut would not be required.
But, there’s no way you would be replacing the tank till long after the top is on in any case. You can slosh all the av/mo gas you want doing fuel testing, etc, during the build and you won’t affect the tank. The tank will have to be in contact with the fuel for an extended period of time to absorb sufficient fuel or entrained solvents to soften the tank material.
From my experience, the tank crack arises after the tank has sat empty for some extended period, such as mono to tri gear conversion. That seems to make the tank material brittle. After the tank has been refilled for some short duration is when the cracking usually occurs.
Just my experience. I’d say finish your aircraft and don’t worry about unless you have an extended down time with an empty tank. If you do, watch carefully for fuel loss or what appears to be sudden excessive fuel consumption.
Blue skies & tailwinds,Bob BorgerEuropa XS Tri, Rotax 914, Airmaster C/S Prop (50 hrs).Little Toot Sport Biplane, Lycoming Thunderbolt AEIO-320 EXP3705 Lynchburg Dr.Corinth, TX 76208-5331Cel: 817-992-1117rlborger(at)mac.com (rlborger(at)mac.com)

On Mar 30, 2014, at 11:57 AM, Fred Klein <fklein(at)orcasonline.com (fklein(at)orcasonline.com)> wrote:

On Mar 30, 2014, at 9:40 AM, William Daniell <wdaniell.longport(at)gmail.com (wdaniell.longport(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
Quote:
I think you're being optimistic I think it would be significantly easier without the top on but I don't see an alternative…


Will…I would never recommend building a Europa to anyone who was not an optimist…but, without wishing to tempt fate, consider the task of replacing tank w/ wings and doors off…IMO, t’would not be much different than w/ top off as well…Fred


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Fred Klein



Joined: 26 Mar 2012
Posts: 503

PostPosted: Sun Mar 30, 2014 10:40 am    Post subject: XS Fuel Tank Kiwi Mod Reply with quote

On Mar 30, 2014, at 10:53 AM, Robert Borger <rlborger(at)mac.com> wrote:

Quote:
Gentlemen,

Having just replaced my fuel tank, I can speak to this issue. I did the replacement with doors on & wings off. There is one issue in fitting the new tank. The door sill on one side must be cut out to allow the new tank to go in:

Bob…sorry to hear that you’ve had to go this, but grateful for your insights into and photos of the process. When installing the new tank, were you following any explicit instructions (from where/who?) as to how best to support and secure the tank?

Did you consider having your tank treated w/ additional fluoridation treatment? If so, did you make all cuts into the tank before sending it off for treatment?

(It’s been my understanding that the cracks were the result of stress concentrations caused by the fiberglass shelf and supports bonding to the tank; consequently I’ve presumed that the “fix”, in addition to the new tank itself, was to ensure there was a bond break or slip sheet between the new tank and it’s supports…but perhaps I’m mistaken, and the brittleness and subsequent cracking is a consequence of fuel interacting w/ the tank material alone, irrespective of potential stress concentrations caused by portions of the tank being unable to expand and contract…?…)

…jus fulla questions, but tryin to get my head around this...

Fred


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 30, 2014 10:54 am    Post subject: XS Fuel Tank Kiwi Mod Reply with quote

let's hope we never have to find out
Will

William Daniell

LONGPORT
+57 310 295 0744


On Sun, Mar 30, 2014 at 11:57 AM, Fred Klein <fklein(at)orcasonline.com (fklein(at)orcasonline.com)> wrote:
[quote]
On Mar 30, 2014, at 9:40 AM, William Daniell <wdaniell.longport(at)gmail.com (wdaniell.longport(at)gmail.com)> wrote:

Quote:
I think you're being optimistic I think it would be significantly easier without the top on but I don't see an alternative&hellip;


Will&hellip;I would never recommend building a Europa to anyone who was not an optimist&hellip;but, without wishing to tempt fate, consider the task of replacing tank w/ wings and doors off&hellip;IMO, t&rsquo;would not be much different than w/ top off as well&hellip;Fred

Quote:


arget="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List
tp://forums.matronics.com
_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution


[b]


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spcialeffects



Joined: 29 Aug 2012
Posts: 305
Location: Kent

PostPosted: Sun Mar 30, 2014 12:06 pm    Post subject: Re: XS Fuel Tank Kiwi Mod Reply with quote

Once the cradle gets bonded in the top "shelf" of the tank is supported by the other lay up 'T' piece which is on the seat back.

asarangan(at)gmail.com wrote:
Your cradle idea is a good one. I am doing something similar right now.
One thing I noticed with your setup is that the tank could potentially
pivot and tip forward under weight. The cradle may need an additional
support at the forward end.
In my case, I am bonding the cradle to both bulkheads (seat back and
baggage bay), creating a sturdy raised floor for the tank to rest on.
Like yours, I also have lateral and fore-aft support to hold the tank
in place. I don't have pictures yet, but will have some soon.

On Sat, Mar 29, 2014 at 5:07 AM, spcialeffects <spcialeffects> wrote:
Quote:


I copied this idea from someone else, think i saw it on the europa org site so all credit to them.


Read this topic online here:

http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=421233#421233


Attachments:

http://forums.matronics.com//files/swollen_tank_161.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/cradle_lay_up_208.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/trimed_and_ready_122.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/gap_behind_tank_165.jpg


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rlborger(at)mac.com
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 30, 2014 2:14 pm    Post subject: XS Fuel Tank Kiwi Mod Reply with quote

Hi Fred,

I used Bud’s instructions for the fuel tank replacement.
Andrew Sarangan and I sent our tanks out for heavy-duty fluoridation.
No, I did not make cuts before fluoridation.

Yes, to the stress concentrations caused by the fiberglass “shelf." My tank cracked right at the corners of one of those fiberglass layups:
[img]cid:64619E84-D1BA-4D2B-B86C-A6DDB1BC9EA5[/img]
In this view the top of the tank is off and you are looking down into the port side of the tank. The crack is pretty well defined in blue and is right on the corner of the outside, forward corner of the “shelf.” Right at the 45º predicted by stress analysis.
Kinda/sorta, the fix is to provide support under the tank. The rear “shelf” is still there attached to the rear bulkhead which carries most of the load supported on a layer of cork. There is also support built under the forward part of the bottom of the tank. This is a thick micro applied in lines upon which the tank was set (plastic wrap used as a parting agent) and the micro allowed to cure. The micro was also covered with cork. The micro is not to provide primary support only secondary support should the gas soften the tank and allow some sag. The micro would support the sag rather than sagging over the shelf causing another stress riser. The aluminum T shelf on the front bulkhead had a layer of urethane foam bonded on top to support the ledge of the tank. This was also covered with cork.
[img]cid:303EFBE6-3486-457C-9F40-977668A5C1D0[/img]


From my (very limited) research on this issue it appears that tank cracking is a combination of things. First, of tank softening due to the absorption of fuel or solvents in the fuel. Second, softening causing sagging. Third, stresses induced by sagging over a corner of the fiberglass used to support the tank on the aft bulkhead. Fourth, perhaps the tank becoming brittle and more susceptible to cracking by removal of the fuel and subsequent evaporation of the fuel or solvent from the softened fuel tank material. I’ve seen pictures of a crack virtually identical to mine only on the starboard side. I also saw a picture of a crack on the starboard side corner of the fiberglass support in the tunnel area.
Some sort of support is needed under the tank to prevent the sagging causing stress risers on the corners of the fiberglass. I’m providing support as suggested by Bud in his fuel tank replacement guide.
Bud has his fuel tank replacement instructions available on his company website.
Being fulla questions isn’t a problem. I just hope you can get satisfactory answers for them.
Blue skies & tailwinds,
Bob Borger
Europa XS Tri, Rotax 914, Airmaster C/S Prop (50 hrs).
Little Toot Sport Biplane, Lycoming Thunderbolt AEIO-320 EXP
3705 Lynchburg Dr.
Corinth, TX 76208-5331
Cel: 817-992-1117
rlborger(at)mac.com (rlborger(at)mac.com)

On Mar 30, 2014, at 1:39 PM, Fred Klein <fklein(at)orcasonline.com (fklein(at)orcasonline.com)> wrote:

--> Europa-List message posted by: Fred Klein <fklein(at)orcasonline.com (fklein(at)orcasonline.com)>
On Mar 30, 2014, at 10:53 AM, Robert Borger <rlborger(at)mac.com (rlborger(at)mac.com)> wrote:

Quote:
Gentlemen,

Having just replaced my fuel tank, I can speak to this issue. I did the replacement with doors on & wings off. There is one issue in fitting the new tank. The door sill on one side must be cut out to allow the new tank to go in:

Bob…sorry to hear that you’ve had to go this, but grateful for your insights into and photos of the process. When installing the new tank, were you following any explicit instructions (from where/who?) as to how best to support and secure the tank?

Did you consider having your tank treated w/ additional fluoridation treatment? If so, did you make all cuts into the tank before sending it off for treatment?

(It’s been my understanding that the cracks were the result of stress concentrations caused by the fiberglass shelf and supports bonding to the tank; consequently I’ve presumed that the “fix”, in addition to the new tank itself, was to ensure there was a bond break or slip sheet between the new tank and it’s supports…but perhaps I’m mistaken, and the brittleness and subsequent cracking is a consequence of fuel interacting w/ the tank material alone, irrespective of potential stress concentrations caused by portions of the tank being unable to expand and contract…?…)

…jus fulla questions, but tryin to get my head around this...

Fred


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asarangan(at)gmail.com
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 30, 2014 3:32 pm    Post subject: XS Fuel Tank Kiwi Mod Reply with quote

FWIW, if the bottom is securely held by the cradle, then the top
should not need a separate support. There is only a couple of gallons
of fuel there anywhere. In fact supporting the top could put weight on
the top shelf and lead to stress at the shelf joint, especially if the
cradle tips forward due to weight.


On Sun, Mar 30, 2014 at 4:06 PM, spcialeffects <spcialeffects(at)aol.com> wrote:
Quote:


Once the cradle gets bonded in the top "shelf" of the tank is supported by the other lay up 'T' piece which is on the seat back.
asarangan(at)gmail.com wrote:
> Your cradle idea is a good one. I am doing something similar right now.
> One thing I noticed with your setup is that the tank could potentially
> pivot and tip forward under weight. The cradle may need an additional
> support at the forward end.
> In my case, I am bonding the cradle to both bulkheads (seat back and
> baggage bay), creating a sturdy raised floor for the tank to rest on.
> Like yours, I also have lateral and fore-aft support to hold the tank
> in place. I don't have pictures yet, but will have some soon.
>
> On Sat, Mar 29, 2014 at 5:07 AM, spcialeffects wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > I copied this idea from someone else, think i saw it on the europa org site so all credit to them.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Read this topic online here:
> >
> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=421233#421233
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Attachments:
> >
> > http://forums.matronics.com//files/swollen_tank_161.jpg
> > http://forums.matronics.com//files/cradle_lay_up_208.jpg
> > http://forums.matronics.com//files/trimed_and_ready_122.jpg
> > http://forums.matronics.com//files/gap_behind_tank_165.jpg
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>

Read this topic online here:

http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=421300#421300




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Roland



Joined: 30 Nov 2009
Posts: 334
Location: EDLE

PostPosted: Sat Aug 04, 2018 2:27 pm    Post subject: Re: XS Fuel Tank Kiwi Mod Reply with quote

Friends,

in the middle of the flying season I'm in for a fuel tank replacement on my Europa XS Trigear (first flight 2001, after a couple of flight hours converted to a Trigear and second first flight as such in 2004).

To make a long story short we have an unusual dry and hot (almost 40°C) summer here in Germany. I was on holidays for two weeks when my Europa was stored in its enclosed trailer with a full tank (like always). After I returned, fuel leaked from the access holes under the belly by about one drop per second. I immediately checked tank ventilation, fuel filler hose, fuel gascolators, hose connections on the tank bottom to no avail. Then I began to drain the tank and after I drained about 15 litres no more fuel leaked. I inspected the tank through the spar holes and every point I could see but didn't discover a crack. Still hoping, that it would only be fuel expansion due to the extreme temperatures and although I already knew better in the back of my mind I refueled again with the same amount of fuel and the dropping started again - of course.

Since I've heard of a couple of Europas with cracked tanks I'm now thinking of installing the aluminium tank of Bill and Sue Sisley from New Zealand. This seems the way to go, since the plastic tank is obviously not up for the job in the longer run. Another advantage might be its resistance against Ethanol which will become more of an issue in the future.

Is there anybody else of you out there using an aluminium tank instead of plastic? Any experiences and thoughts much appreciated.

Regards
Roland
XS TG 914


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budyerly(at)msn.com
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 05, 2018 8:22 am    Post subject: XS Fuel Tank Kiwi Mod Reply with quote

Roland,

I am no longer a Europa dealer, so I'm saying this as an owner. The new Europa tank is quite improved. On my website, you can see how I've done this as well as how to properly support the tank. It is also on the Europa club website.


I am a 9 year survivor of a tank replacement. My tank is kept nearly full always and in 95F weather. The PTFE tank doesn't sweat, and hasn't bulged at all. All the fittings fit without modification.


Regards,

Bud Yerly

www. customflightcreations.com


Bud Yerly

Custom Flight Creations


From: owner-europa-list-server(at)matronics.com <owner-europa-list-server(at)matronics.com> on behalf of Roland <schmidtroland(at)web.de>
Sent: Saturday, August 4, 2018 6:27:55 PM
To: europa-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: XS Fuel Tank Kiwi Mod


--> Europa-List message posted by: "Roland" <schmidtroland(at)web.de>

Friends,

in the middle of the flying season I'm in for a fuel tank replacement on my Europa XS Trigear (first flight 2001, after a couple of flight hours converted to a Trigear and second first flight as such in 2004).

To make a long story short we have an unusual dry and hot (almost 40°C) summer here in Germany. I was on holidays for two weeks when my Europa was stored in its enclosed trailer with a full tank (like always). After I returned, fuel leaked from the access holes under the belly by about one drop per second. I immediately checked fuel filler hose, fuel gascolators, hose connections on the tank bottom to no avail. Then I began to drain the tank and after I drained about 15 litres no more fuel leaked. I inspected the tank through the spar holes and every point I could see but didn't discover a crack. Still hoping, that it would only be fuel expansion due to the extreme temperatures and although I already knew better in the back of my mind I refueled again with the same amount of fuel and the dropping started again - of course.  

Since I've heard of a couple of Europas with cracked tanks I'm now thinking of installing the aluminium tank of Bill and Sue Sisley from New Zealand. This seems the way to go, since the plastic tank is obviously not up for the job in the longer run. Another advantage might be its resistance against Ethanol which will become more of an issue in the future.

Is there anybody else of you out there using an aluminium tank instead of plastic? Any experiences and thoughts much appreciated.

Regards
Roland
XS TG 914




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PostPosted: Sun Aug 05, 2018 9:38 am    Post subject: XS Fuel Tank Kiwi Mod Reply with quote

Make sure the replacement has been properly flourinated. I had my tank flourinated in atlanta (same guys who do the auto gas tanks for the big guys as well as shampoo bottles etc.), and even though mine was done by the europa supplier, it came back from my guys with a total frosted finish....so something incremental was appearantly done. I made sure to do all my tank trimming prior to getting it done, so theoretically it should be encapsulated to prevent swelling. As me in 10 years if it worked (after i get my pile of parts in the air lol)
Cheers,
Pete

On Aug 5, 2018, at 12:19 PM, Bud Yerly <budyerly(at)msn.com (budyerly(at)msn.com)> wrote:
Quote:
Roland,

I am no longer a Europa dealer, so I'm saying this as an owner. The new Europa tank is quite improved. On my website, you can see how I've done this as well as how to properly support the tank. It is also on the Europa club website.


I am a 9 year survivor of a tank replacement. My tank is kept nearly full always and in 95F weather. The PTFE tank doesn't sweat, and hasn't bulged at all. All the fittings fit without modification.


Regards,

Bud Yerly

www. customflightcreations.com


Bud Yerly

Custom Flight Creations


From: owner-europa-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-europa-list-server(at)matronics.com) <owner-europa-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-europa-list-server(at)matronics.com)> on behalf of Roland <schmidtroland(at)web.de (schmidtroland(at)web.de)>
Sent: Saturday, August 4, 2018 6:27:55 PM
To: europa-list(at)matronics.com (europa-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: XS Fuel Tank Kiwi Mod


--> Europa-List message posted by: "Roland" <schmidtroland(at)web.de (schmidtroland(at)web.de)>

Friends,

in the middle of the flying season I'm in for a fuel tank replacement on my Europa XS Trigear (first flight 2001, after a couple of flight hours converted to a Trigear and second first flight as such in 2004).

To make a long story short we have an unusual dry and hot (almost 40°C) summer here in Germany. I was on holidays for two weeks when my Europa was stored in its enclosed trailer with a full tank (like always). After I returned, fuel leaked from the access holes under the belly by about one drop per second. I immediately checked fuel filler hose, fuel gascolators, hose connections on the tank bottom to no avail. Then I began to drain the tank and after I drained about 15 litres no more fuel leaked. I inspected the tank through the spar holes and every point I could see but didn't discover a crack. Still hoping, that it would only be fuel expansion due to the extreme temperatures and although I already knew better in the back of my mind I refueled again with the same amount of fuel and the dropping started again - of course.

Since I've heard of a couple of Europas with cracked tanks I'm now thinking of installing the aluminium tank of Bill and Sue Sisley from New Zealand. This seems the way to go, since the plastic tank is obviously not up for the job in the longer run. Another advantage might be its resistance against Ethanol which will become more of an issue in the future.

Is there anybody else of you out there using an aluminium tank instead of plastic? Any experiences and thoughts much appreciated.

Regards
Roland
XS TG 914




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PostPosted: Sun Aug 05, 2018 11:03 am    Post subject: XS Fuel Tank Kiwi Mod Reply with quote

Pete,
I don’t think that is necessary for the PTFE tank. Only the original tanks done before about 2000. Anyway, almost 10 years with mine now and nothing done to the tank and it is fine.  Older tanks than 2006 I won’t bet on anything.

Best Regards,
Bud Yerly

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: owner-europa-list-server(at)matronics.com <owner-europa-list-server(at)matronics.com> on behalf of Pete <peterz(at)zutrasoft.com>
Sent: Sunday, August 5, 2018 1:36:51 PM
To: europa-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: Re: XS Fuel Tank Kiwi Mod


Make sure the replacement has been properly flourinated. I had my tank flourinated in atlanta (same guys who do the auto gas tanks for the big guys as well as shampoo bottles etc.), and even though mine was done by the europa supplier, it came back from my guys with a total frosted finish....so something incremental was appearantly done. I made sure to do all my tank trimming prior to getting it done, so theoretically it should be encapsulated to prevent swelling. As me in 10 years if it worked (after i get my pile of parts in the air lol)


Cheers,
Pete

On Aug 5, 2018, at 12:19 PM, Bud Yerly <budyerly(at)msn.com (budyerly(at)msn.com)> wrote:


Quote:
Roland,

I am no longer a Europa dealer, so I'm saying this as an owner. The new Europa tank is quite improved. On my website, you can see how I've done this as well as how to properly support the tank. It is also on the Europa club website.


I am a 9 year survivor of a tank replacement. My tank is kept nearly full always and in 95F weather. The PTFE tank doesn't sweat, and hasn't bulged at all. All the fittings fit without modification.


Regards,

Bud Yerly

www. customflightcreations.com


Bud Yerly

Custom Flight Creations


From: owner-europa-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-europa-list-server(at)matronics.com) <owner-europa-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-europa-list-server(at)matronics.com)> on behalf of Roland <schmidtroland(at)web.de (schmidtroland(at)web.de)>
Sent: Saturday, August 4, 2018 6:27:55 PM
To: europa-list(at)matronics.com (europa-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: XS Fuel Tank Kiwi Mod


--> Europa-List message posted by: "Roland" <schmidtroland(at)web.de (schmidtroland(at)web.de)>

Friends,

in the middle of the flying season I'm in for a fuel tank replacement on my Europa XS Trigear (first flight 2001, after a couple of flight hours converted to a Trigear and second first flight as such in 2004).

To make a long story short we have an unusual dry and hot (almost 40°C) summer here in Germany. I was on holidays for two weeks when my Europa was stored in its enclosed trailer with a full tank (like always). After I returned, fuel leaked from the access holes under the belly by about one drop per second. I immediately checked fuel filler hose, fuel gascolators, hose connections on the tank bottom to no avail. Then I began to drain the tank and after I drained about 15 litres no more fuel leaked. I inspected the tank through the spar holes and every point I could see but didn't discover a crack. Still hoping, that it would only be fuel expansion due to the extreme temperatures and although I already knew better in the back of my mind I refueled again with the same amount of fuel and the dropping started again - of course.  

Since I've heard of a couple of Europas with cracked tanks I'm now thinking of installing the aluminium tank of Bill and Sue Sisley from New Zealand. This seems the way to go, since the plastic tank is obviously not up for the job in the longer run. Another advantage might be its resistance against Ethanol which will become more of an issue in the future.

Is there anybody else of you out there using an aluminium tank instead of plastic? Any experiences and thoughts much appreciated.

Regards
Roland
XS TG 914




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