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Pre buy inpection questions.

 
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j_dunavin



Joined: 21 Jun 2010
Posts: 95
Location: Northern IL

PostPosted: Mon Aug 13, 2018 6:42 pm    Post subject: Pre buy inpection questions. Reply with quote

I'm looking at a Piet for sale that has a corvair motor and was apparently built per the manual. It has no 5th bearing and a Harley Davidson carb.
I suppose the right thing to do is tear it back down and verify proper modifications, block, crank numbers, as well a getting a 5th bearing for it.
Assume nothing, right?

Kind of related question:
The aircraft is mostly finished, covered painted, etc. It looks like a good quality build, from what I can see in the inspection panels and whatnot. Landing gear is metal type, with cross springs, good looking welds, supposedly from a certified guy.
However, there is no build log, and very few pictures, like 6 maybe. No receipts, and except for a copy of the plans and misc notes, drawings, no paperwork.
It's never been finished, no N number etc.
How would that work with an inspection?
How would an EAA tech advisor. Or whomever the guy is that gives you the certificate, sign that off?
I'm have my A&P so even though I'm not the original builder I could work on it.

Thoughts?
Thanks


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braywood



Joined: 29 Sep 2012
Posts: 17
Location: Northern Ireland

PostPosted: Tue Aug 14, 2018 12:57 am    Post subject: Re: Pre buy inpection questions. Reply with quote

Hello J - a few questions you might ask; would you, as an A&P sign it off? Would you fly it? Would you ask someone else to fly it? Would you take your family up in it?
Is it too good a deal to pass up? How much work are you willing to invest? Should you strip the covering to inspect thoroughly?
Any way to contact the builder?
Getting it registered is a whole other issue.
my 2 cents.

Mark B.


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j_dunavin



Joined: 21 Jun 2010
Posts: 95
Location: Northern IL

PostPosted: Tue Aug 14, 2018 4:34 am    Post subject: Re: Pre buy inpection questions. Reply with quote

Unfortunately the original builder has passed away.
It is a great deal, but I have no way of verifying what's under the skin, other than what I can see.
It's really unfortunate... Sad
Supposedly some tech advisor looked at it before it was covered, but it still comes down to no build log.
How would someone go about that?
Even if you ripped all the fabric off, would that be enough? I mean, what glue did he use?


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pietflyer



Joined: 19 Jun 2017
Posts: 28

PostPosted: Tue Aug 14, 2018 5:08 am    Post subject: Pre buy inpection questions. Reply with quote

" I'm have my A&P so even though I'm not the original builder I could work
on it." You could work on it whether you built it or not, and whether you
were an A&P or not. As an A&P you can do the Condition Inspections on it,
even though you didn't build it.

The Special Airworthiness Certificate will have to be issued by a DAR or by
the local FAA FSDO. This would be the case whether you built it or not.

As for the Corvair powerplant, I'll let those who know Corvairs comment.
Perhaps you can contact William Wynne, since he knows more about them than
anyone else.

Good Luck!

Jack Phillips
Pietenpol NX899JP "Icarus Plummet"
Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia

--


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btahrens(at)gmail.com
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 16, 2018 12:31 pm    Post subject: Pre buy inpection questions. Reply with quote

Based on the info you provided alone, I’d be a bit skeptical as to whether the corvair was built per “the manual,” as William Wynn is pretty vocal about his opposition to using motorcycle carbs or anything other than a Stromberg or an MA-3. It’s not a smoking gun, but it’s reasonable to suspect that the builder might’ve made other deviations from the manual if he was willing to diverge from this very important bit of guidance. 

Not saying that you can’t built a flight engine any other way than WW says, but he does spill quite a bit of ink talking about carbs. I imagine he’d say the same thing if you were to contact him. 
Brian Ahrens

On Tue, Aug 14, 2018 at 9:11 AM Jack Philips <jack(at)bedfordlandings.com (jack(at)bedfordlandings.com)> wrote:

[quote]--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Jack Philips" <jack(at)bedfordlandings.com (jack(at)bedfordlandings.com)>

" I'm have my A&P so even though I'm not the original builder I could work
on it."  You could work on it whether you built it or not, and whether you
were an A&P or not.  As an A&P you can do the Condition Inspections on it,
even though you didn't build it.

The Special Airworthiness Certificate will have to be issued by a DAR or by
the local FAA FSDO.  This would be the case whether you built it or not.

As for the Corvair powerplant, I'll let those who know Corvairs comment.
Perhaps you can contact William Wynne, since he knows more about them than
anyone else.

Good Luck!

Jack Phillips
Pietenpol NX899JP "Icarus Plummet"
Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia

--


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aviatorbell(at)yahoo.com
Guest





PostPosted: Thu Aug 16, 2018 1:35 pm    Post subject: Pre buy inpection questions. Reply with quote

Is it the blue and White Piet. I bought a unfinished Baby Lakes about 5 years ago that was not quite as completed as the piet. I called my local FSDO and discussed the project over the phone. The inspector was very accommodating and helpful. I will admit that i was worried when my proposed 6 month winter project turned into a four year project. I was worried that the inspector may get moved to another fsdo and the next guy may not license it. I had the same issue with a construction log, i had 2 paragraphs on the back of a Winston cigarette carton, and 3 photos of the wing fittings and an uncovered wing panel.  So call the FSDO share your concerns and disclose what you are planning to do with the project and act on it accordingly. 
Shad
Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone
On Thursday, August 16, 2018, 4:30 PM, Brian Ahrens <btahrens(at)gmail.com> wrote:

Based on the info you provided alone, I’d be a bit skeptical as to whether the corvair was built per “the manual,” as William Wynn is pretty vocal about his opposition to using motorcycle carbs or anything other than a Stromberg or an MA-3. It’s not a smoking gun, but it’s reasonable to suspect that the builder might’ve made other deviations from the manual if he was willing to diverge from this very important bit of guidance. 
Not saying that you can’t built a flight engine any other way than WW says, but he does spill quite a bit of ink talking about carbs. I imagine he’d say the same thing if you were to contact him. 
Brian Ahrens

On Tue, Aug 14, 2018 at 9:11 AM Jack Philips <jack(at)bedfordlandings.com> wrote:



" I'm have my A&P so even though I'm not the original builder I could work
on it."  You could work on it whether you built it or not, and whether you
were an A&P or not.  As an A&P you can do the Condition Inspections on it,
even though you didn't build it.

The Special Airworthiness Certificate will have to be issued by a DAR or by
the local FAA FSDO.  This would be the case whether you built it or not.

As for the Corvair powerplant, I'll let those who know Corvairs comment.
Perhaps you can contact William Wynne, since he knows more about them than
anyone else.

Good Luck!

Jack Phillips
Pietenpol NX899JP "Icarus Plummet"
Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia

--


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