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shore power combined with LiFePO battery

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kenryan

Joined: 20 Oct 2009
Posts: 424

Posted: Wed Jun 26, 2019 7:34 am Post subject: shore power combined with LiFePO battery

I am finishing up my airplane and it is starting to sink in that I really need to spend some hours sitting in it getting used to the instrumentation (I have never used glass cockpit before this). So there is a need to sit in the airplane with shore power connected to keep from running down the EarthX battery. But I am concerned about using shore power with lithium battery technology because of their charging sensitivities. What do you guys think? Would it be okay to connect an adjustable power supply to the electrical system, with the battery in place? If so, what should I set the voltage for? The problem is that pulling the battery is a bit of a hassle and takes about a half hour. Same for installation. It would be better if I could just plug in.



Thanks,Â 

Ken

cluros(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Wed Jun 26, 2019 7:58 am Post subject: shore power combined with LiFePO battery

If you aren't planning on pulling the battery before going for a flight and running the alternator, I wouldn't consider pulling the battery before running a power supply on the ground. Your alternator will likely put out 13.8 - 14.5 V, set your power supply to somewhere in there and find a convenient place to plug in.



You may want to pull the field breaker, the alternator can pull a few amps and get quite hot on the ground if the bus voltage is below the regulator set voltage. My boss once unplugged a power supply from the wall while still plugged in to the aircraft with the battery master on, smoked a wire but the power supply is ok. We now have a 10A breaker in the power supply wires just in case he does it again or there is a power failure or something.



On Wed, Jun 26, 2019 at 8:38 AM Ken Ryan <keninalaska(at)gmail.com (keninalaska(at)gmail.com)> wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		  I am finishing up my airplane and it is starting to sink in that I really need to spend some hours sitting in it getting used to the instrumentation (I have never used glass cockpit before this). So there is a need to sit in the airplane with shore power connected to keep from running down the EarthX battery. But I am concerned about using shore power with lithium battery technology because of their charging sensitivities. What do you guys think? Would it be okay to connect an adjustable power supply to the electrical system, with the battery in place? If so, what should I set the voltage for? The problem is that pulling the battery is a bit of a hassle and takes about a half hour. Same for installation. It would be better if I could just plug in.



Thanks,Â 

Ken

rick(at)beebe.org
Guest

Posted: Wed Jun 26, 2019 8:02 am Post subject: shore power combined with LiFePO battery

I would set it to         whatever you expect out of your alternator.Â  13.8v say. The         EarthX will protect itself from being overcharged. You just want         the voltage high enough that you're not drawing from the         battery.     

--Rick

          On 6/26/2019 11:32 AM, Ken Ryan wrote:

     

      	  Quote: 	
		                I am finishing up my airplane and it is starting to         sink in that I really need to spend some hours sitting in it         getting used to the instrumentation (I have never used glass         cockpit before this). So there is a need to sit in the airplane         with shore power connected to keep from running down the EarthX         battery. But I am concerned about using shore power with lithium         battery technology because of their charging sensitivities. What         do you guys think? Would it be okay to connect an adjustable         power supply to the electrical system, with the battery in         place? If so, what should I set the voltage for? The problem is         that pulling the battery is a bit of a hassle and takes about a         half hour. Same for installation. It would be better if I could         just plug in.         

         

         Thanks,Â 

         

         

         Ken

nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelect
Guest

Posted: Wed Jun 26, 2019 10:00 am Post subject: shore power combined with LiFePO battery

At 10:32 AM 6/26/2019, you wrote:

  	  Quote: 	
		  I am finishing up my airplane and it is starting to sink in that I really need to spend some hours sitting in it getting used to the instrumentation (I have never used glass cockpit before this). So there is a need to sit in the airplane with shore power connected to keep from running down the EarthX battery. But I am concerned about using shore power with lithium battery technology because of their charging sensitivities. What do you guys think? Would it be okay to connect an adjustable power supply to the electrical system, with the battery in place? If so, what should I set the voltage for? The problem is that pulling the battery is a bit of a hassle and takes about a half hour. Same for installation. It would be better if I could just plug in. 	


   How about a ground power connector?



   alternatively . . .



   How hard is it to get to the hot

   side of your starter contactor?



   You can clip the (+) lead from the

   power supply directly to the nut

   on the battery-side stud. Set the

   power supply for 14v before turning

   it on.



 [img]cid:7.1.0.9.0.20190626124946.0608b270(at)aeroelectric.com.0[/img] 



   Clips like these are good for 30+

   amps and would handle your needs

   nicely. Obviously, the (-) clip

   goes to handy ground.



   Leave ship's master switch OFF. 



 



 

 

   Bob . . .

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kenryan

Joined: 20 Oct 2009
Posts: 424

Posted: Wed Jun 26, 2019 10:49 am Post subject: shore power combined with LiFePO battery

Thanks Bob. Your gentle reminder that the battery is not connected to the rest of the system until the master switch is turned on opens up a number of possible solutions.



Ken

On Wed, Jun 26, 2019, 10:06 Robert L. Nuckolls, III <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com (nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com)> wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		    At 10:32 AM 6/26/2019, you wrote:

  	  Quote: 	
		  I am finishing up my airplane and it is starting to sink in that I really need to spend some hours sitting in it getting used to the instrumentation (I have never used glass cockpit before this). So there is a need to sit in the airplane with shore power connected to keep from running down the EarthX battery. But I am concerned about using shore power with lithium battery technology because of their charging sensitivities. What do you guys think? Would it be okay to connect an adjustable power supply to the electrical system, with the battery in place? If so, what should I set the voltage for? The problem is that pulling the battery is a bit of a hassle and takes about a half hour. Same for installation. It would be better if I could just plug in. 	


 Â  How about a ground power connector?



 Â  alternatively . . .



 Â  How hard is it to get to the hot

 Â  side of your starter contactor?



 Â  You can clip the (+) lead from the

 Â  power supply directly to the nut

 Â  on the battery-side stud. Set the

 Â  power supply for 14v before turning

 Â  it on.



 [img]cid:7.1.0.9.0.20190626124946.0608b270(at)aeroelectric.com.0[/img] 



 Â  Clips like these are good for 30+

 Â  amps and would handle your needs

 Â  nicely. Obviously, the (-) clip

 Â  goes to handy ground.



 Â  Leave ship's master switch OFF. 



 



 

 

 Â  Bob . . .

1dc6c222.jpg

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23 KB

Viewed:

5975 Time(s)

ashleysc(at)broadstripe.n
Guest

Posted: Thu Jun 27, 2019 7:35 pm Post subject: shore power combined with LiFePO battery

Hi Ken;

Check out Battery Tender 022-0209-DL-WH which is a 4 and battery charger/maintainer that is selectable for conventional or lithium iron batteries. I have a lithium iron battery in my aircraft while wiring that is continually plugged into this charger. Battery seems happy. Allows me to do testing as I add each circuit.

Cheers!   Stu.

From: "Ken Ryan" <keninalaska(at)gmail.com>

To: aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com

Sent: Wednesday, June 26, 2019 8:32:37 AM

Subject: shore power combined with LiFePO battery

I am finishing up my airplane and it is starting to sink in that I really need to spend some hours sitting in it getting used to the instrumentation (I have never used glass cockpit before this). So there is a need to sit in the airplane with shore power connected to keep from running down the EarthX battery. But I am concerned about using shore power with lithium battery technology because of their charging sensitivities. What do you guys think? Would it be okay to connect an adjustable power supply to the electrical system, with the battery in place? If so, what should I set the voltage for? The problem is that pulling the battery is a bit of a hassle and takes about a half hour. Same for installation. It would be better if I could just plug in.

Thanks, 

Ken

fvalarm(at)rapidnet.net
Guest

Posted: Fri Jun 28, 2019 3:17 pm Post subject: shore power combined with LiFePO battery

Hard to say without knowing how your electrical system is       configured.Â  You could have a charge cord permanently connected to       your battery.Â Â  I secured mine so that its accessible from the oil       filler door.Â  Plug in a standard Lithium charger (not the balance       charger) while you're playing with the glass.Â  Turn all non       essential stuff off and pull breakers.Â  If you have an "essential       bus", the EFIS should be on the Ebus and then you can turn the       master contacter off saving an amp or so.     

Bevan

          On 6/27/2019 8:34 PM,       ashleysc(at)broadstripe.net (ashleysc(at)broadstripe.net) wrote:

     

      	  Quote: 	
		                         Hi Ken;

         Check out Battery Tender 022-0209-DL-WH which is a 4 and           battery charger/maintainer that is selectable for conventional           or lithium iron batteries. I have a lithium iron battery in my           aircraft while wiring that is continually plugged into this           charger. Battery seems happy. Allows me to do testing as I add           each circuit.

         Cheers!Â  Â Stu.

         

         

                  From:           "Ken Ryan" <keninalaska(at)gmail.com> (keninalaska(at)gmail.com)

           To: aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com (aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com)

           Sent: Wednesday, June 26, 2019 8:32:37 AM

           Subject: shore power combined with           LiFePO battery

           

           

           I am finishing up my airplane and it is             starting to sink in that I really need to spend some hours             sitting in it getting used to the instrumentation (I have             never used glass cockpit before this). So there is a need to             sit in the airplane with shore power connected to keep from             running down the EarthX battery. But I am concerned about             using shore power with lithium battery technology because of             their charging sensitivities. What do you guys think? Would             it be okay to connect an adjustable power supply to the             electrical system, with the battery in place? If so, what             should I set the voltage for? The problem is that pulling             the battery is a bit of a hassle and takes about a half             hour. Same for installation. It would be better if I could             just plug in.             

             

             Thanks,Â 

             

             

             Ken

             

             

           

         

         

         

       

     -- 

Bevan Tomm

Senior Technician

Fraser Valley Alarm Services Inc.

bevan(at)fvas.bc.ca (bevan(at)fvas.bc.ca)

office 604-854-2994

Fax 604-852-6408 	
     	          		Virus-free. www.avg.com 		 	    [url=#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2] [/url]

nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelect
Guest

Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2019 3:19 am Post subject: shore power combined with LiFePO battery

At 10:34 PM 6/27/2019, you wrote:

  	  Quote: 	
		  Hi Ken;

 Check out Battery Tender 022-0209-DL-WH which is a 4 and battery charger/maintainer that is selectable for conventional or lithium iron batteries. I have a lithium iron battery in my aircraft while wiring that is continually plugged into this charger. Battery seems happy. Allows me to do testing as I add each circuit.

 Cheers!   Stu. 	


 This device is not a 'ground power' source of energy.

 Ken needs a current limited, voltage regulated

 laboratory or bench supply that emulates his alternator/

 battery system.



 Here's a couple of examples:



  https://tinyurl.com/y2nb5gyv



  https://tinyurl.com/y4taw7rc



  https://tinyurl.com/yytdzdvg



 These are suited for powering up the bus

 with the ship's battery and alternator

 OFF line.



 

 

   Bob . . .

art(at)zemon.name
Guest

Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2019 4:01 am Post subject: shore power combined with LiFePO battery

Ken,

I was in the same position when I was finishing up my airplane. I did two things that might work for you, too.

First, I simply hooked up my plane's battery. I removed all of the fuses to the devices which did not need power. Then I turned on the master. That battery would run the EFIS for longer than I wanted to sit in the cockpit in the garage (mine happens to be lead acid but I expect your LiFePO will do the same). When I was not using the battery to power the airplane, I hooked up a charger and recharged it.

Second, I found that my MGL iEFIS has a very good emulator. I loaded that onto my laptop and found that it was way more comfortable to sit in my armchair in my air conditioned living room and play with the emulator than it was to sit in the cockpit. It became my primary means of learning my EFIS. You didn't say which brand of EFIS you have but perhaps you can get some similar software.

Maybe one or both of those ideas will work for you. They had the advantage of being simple and not requiring me to buy anything which is not useful for a long time (well past the time required to build the airplane). The only thing that I bought was a battery charger and, since I have a lead acid batter, that came from the local auto parts store. I don't know what you need for your LeFePO battery but presumably a charger is less expensive than a regulated power supply.

Cheers,

Â  Â  -- Art Z.





On Wed, Jun 26, 2019 at 10:48 AM Ken Ryan <keninalaska(at)gmail.com (keninalaska(at)gmail.com)> wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		  I am finishing up my airplane and it is starting to sink in that I really need to spend some hours sitting in it getting used to the instrumentation (I have never used glass cockpit before this). So there is a need to sit in the airplane with shore power connected to keep from running down the EarthX battery. But I am concerned about using shore power with lithium battery technology because of their charging sensitivities. What do you guys think? Would it be okay to connect an adjustable power supply to the electrical system, with the battery in place? If so, what should I set the voltage for? The problem is that pulling the battery is a bit of a hassle and takes about a half hour. Same for installation. It would be better if I could just plug in.



Thanks,Â 

Ken



 	


-- 

https://CheerfulCurmudgeon.com/Pray as if everything depends on God. Act as if everything depends on you.

kenryan

Joined: 20 Oct 2009
Posts: 424

Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2019 7:09 am Post subject: shore power combined with LiFePO battery

Thanks everyone for the replies. I created a non existent problem when I failed to make the obvious observation that if the master is not close d the battery is out of the picture, and so all I need to do is to connect my power supply to a point downstream from the battery contactor, as Bob pointed out. That's easy. I'm going to look for a Dynon Skyview emulator. That's the best solution to this particular problem.



On Sat, Jun 29, 2019, 03:24 Robert L. Nuckolls, III <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com (nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com)> wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		    At 10:34 PM 6/27/2019, you wrote:

  	  Quote: 	
		  Hi Ken;

 Check out Battery Tender 022-0209-DL-WH which is a 4 and battery charger/maintainer that is selectable for conventional or lithium iron batteries. I have a lithium iron battery in my aircraft while wiring that is continually plugged into this charger. Battery seems happy. Allows me to do testing as I add each circuit.

 Cheers!Â Â  Stu. 	


 This device is not a 'ground power' source of energy.

 Ken needs a current limited, voltage regulated

 laboratory or bench supply that emulates his alternator/

 battery system.



 Here's a couple of examples:



  https://tinyurl.com/y2nb5gyv



  https://tinyurl.com/y4taw7rc



  https://tinyurl.com/yytdzdvg



 These are suited for powering up the bus

 with the ship's battery and alternator

 OFF line.



 

 

 Â  Bob . . .

farmrjohn

Joined: 31 Dec 2018
Posts: 54

Posted: Mon Dec 07, 2020 1:56 pm Post subject: Re: shore power combined with LiFePO battery

 	  nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelect wrote: 	
		  

 This device is not a 'ground power' source of energy.

 Ken needs a current limited, voltage regulated

 laboratory or bench supply that emulates his alternator/

 battery system.



 Here's a couple of examples:



  https://tinyurl.com/y2nb5gyv



  https://tinyurl.com/y4taw7rc



  https://tinyurl.com/yytdzdvg



 These are suited for powering up the bus

 with the ship's battery and alternator

 OFF line.



 

 

   Bob . . . 	




Resurecting a thread, would something like this be suitable for powering the electronics in the hangar with the other electrical equipment "off line"?

https://tinyurl.com/y5jtl725

John

Ceengland

Joined: 11 Oct 2020
Posts: 381
Location: MS

Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2020 2:59 pm Post subject: shore power combined with LiFePO battery

On 12/8/2020 4:06 PM, Robert L.       Nuckolls, III wrote:

     

      	  Quote: 	
		                 	  Quote: 	
		  

           Resurecting a thread, would something like this be suitable           for powering           the electronics in the hangar with the other electrical           equipment           "off line"?

                        https://tinyurl.com/y5jtl725

           John 	
       

       

          Yeah . . . sort of. Waayy back when I had

            a good source for the line of Samlex fixed

            voltage, overload protected "bricks",

            I think I was able to offer a 14v switchmode

            power supply good for 20A for under $100 . . .

            but that's putting a stretch on the gray matter.

         

            How about spending a few more $ and getting

            a piece of test equipment. Here's  fully

            instrumented, adjustable supply good for

            a lot more snort.

         

                    https://tinyurl.com/y2q2v37h

         

            It's on sale for the next week or so. I

            have several supplies of this genre' that

            have been helpful in recent battery performance

            studies.

         

            Best yet, this supply gives you a real-time

            suite of values on the load. You can set

            it for 14.5v, max current and clip it in

            place of the ship's battery. Everything

            up to and including 10A of load is characterized.

            You can MEASURED real time operating loads

            of the ship's electro-whizzies.

         

            After the project it finished, it becomes

            valuable bench test tool. I've got more

            power supplies than any other class of

            tool. They range from a 30V 0.25A current

            limited HP supply that came off my bench at Numec

            in 1964.

         

            Big daddy is a 40V/40A HP 'boat anchor' I got for cheap

            off eBay probably 30 years ago . . . still

            works great. I'm getting ready to move it

            from my electronics bench in the house

            out to the mess-making shop where I have

            a 240v feeder that will allow me to access

            the supply's full capabilities.

         

            The short answer is: For a few dollars more

            you can acquire a test tool with a lot more

            present and future value than the         "brick".

         

                

             Bob . . .

            	
     I bought this one:

 https://smile.amazon.com/RoMech-30V-Power-Supply-Variable/dp/B081SKNHTV/ref=redir_mobile_desktop?ie=UTF8&aaxitk=5h-S.3NU5Fhc1ep7Q0UrxQ&hsa_cr_id=8827375660301&ref_=sbx_be_s_sparkle_mcd_asin_0

     with different branding (probably from ebay) a couple of years ago,     and have been happy with it. You can probably find it for closer to     $55 if you search. Voltage is a direct display; amps displays actual     current but can be limited with the knobs. I just marked knob     positions to get myself in the ballpark when I want to limit     current.

     

     Charlie

     	          		Virus-free. www.avast.com 		 	 [url=#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2] [/url]

_________________
Charlie

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