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Powergenie - anyone using it? DIY ideas?

 
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hdwysong(at)gmail.com
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2006 9:43 am    Post subject: Powergenie - anyone using it? DIY ideas? Reply with quote

Is anyone using this gadget?

http://tinyurl.com/cg3az

More expensive ($30) than an oil pressure sender with aux 'warning'
contacts ($25), but still interesting. Any ideas about what's under
the hood? Ideas for a DIY version?

D


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aadamson(at)highrf.com
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2006 10:12 am    Post subject: Powergenie - anyone using it? DIY ideas? Reply with quote

This is so curious.... I've never understood the want or need for a "hobbs"
type meter in an airplane that you own. I suppose for 2 reasons. A) most
of the engine monitors of which just about everyone has no a days has one
built in; b) what information do they give you that you need. No maint that
I know of uses hobbs time, they are all tach time. And if you just need to
know how long the flight is, then get a cheap timer or wear a watch.

This is just soo odd for me... Perhaps someone can help enlighten me on this
topic?

Alan

--


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rv8ch



Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 250
Location: Switzerland

PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2006 10:40 am    Post subject: Powergenie - anyone using it? DIY ideas? Reply with quote

Quote:
This is just soo odd for me... Perhaps someone can help enlighten me on this
topic?

Alan

Having "hobbs time" is good so that when you post the
number of hours on your aircraft in your signature,
the number will be larger. See below. That's kewl.
--
Mickey Coggins
http://www.rv8.ch/
#82007 finishing

0000.0 hours
do not archive


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Mark Phillips in TN



Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 431
Location: Columbia, TN

PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2006 11:52 am    Post subject: Powergenie - anyone using it? DIY ideas? Reply with quote

In a message dated 01/29/2006 12:13:36 PM Central Standard Time,
aadamson(at)highrf.com writes:
I've never understood the want or need for a "hobbs"
type meter in an airplane that you own.
Quote:
>>

Don't reckon it's much of a "gotta have", but I like mine simply because it's
a historically reliable mechanical device (activated by oil pressure switch)
that keeps my logbooks in order, for maintenance and continuity reasons. My
engine monitor time will always show less time (engine idling not recorded) and
it's probably more likely I'll have an airframe log entry stating "engine
monitor changed at 853.3 hours" than "Hobbs meter replaced- add 8,533 hours at
each entry"

Mark Phillips - RV-6A N51PW, whose 2nd BIRTHDAY is day after tomorrow with
277.3 hours on the HOBBS! ...er, maybe I should use EIS time so she stays
younger longer! Cool
do not archive


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aadamson(at)highrf.com
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2006 1:32 pm    Post subject: Powergenie - anyone using it? DIY ideas? Reply with quote

Yes, but you don't base your maint on hobbs time, you base it on tach time.
At least everyone I know does. I suppose it let's you say, xxx SMOH, and
yyy TTAE.... But that later is of no value except to know how long the time
is you want to put in your logbook as "flight time".

I totally get Tach time (it's the slower one, cuz it's based upon RPM), but
I don't get a hobbs type meter in anything but a flight school airplane.

Alan

--


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rd2(at)evenlink.com
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2006 2:27 pm    Post subject: Powergenie - anyone using it? DIY ideas? Reply with quote

Quote:
Any ideas about what's under the hood?

Might be a vibration switch, I saw a portable hour meter (in Wag-Aero's
catalog) that turns itself on from the engine vibration; worked pretty
decently.

rumen
do not archive

_____________________Original message __________________________
(received from D Wysong; Date: 11:40 AM 1/29/2006 -0600)



Is anyone using this gadget?

http://tinyurl.com/cg3az

More expensive ($30) than an oil pressure sender with aux 'warning'
contacts ($25), but still interesting. Any ideas about what's under
the hood? Ideas for a DIY version?

D




--


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lhelming(at)sigecom.net
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2006 2:27 pm    Post subject: Powergenie - anyone using it? DIY ideas? Reply with quote

Interesting. According to my AFS system (ACS2002) the tach time is about
80% of the hobbs time. I always report hobbs time. As I get into doing
longer SC flights the ratio will change.

Indiana Larry, RV7 Tip Up SunSeeker 80 hours HOBBS

---


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2006 3:13 pm    Post subject: Powergenie - anyone using it? DIY ideas? Reply with quote

Really SC should be XC (cross country).
Indiana Larry

[quote]
<lhelming(at)sigecom.net>

Interesting. According to my AFS system (ACS2002) the tach time is about
80% of the hobbs time. I always report hobbs time. As I get into doing
longer SC flights the ratio will change.

Indiana Larry, RV7 Tip Up SunSeeker 80 hours HOBBS

---


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aadamson(at)highrf.com
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2006 3:53 pm    Post subject: Powergenie - anyone using it? DIY ideas? Reply with quote

You always "report hobbs time" to what/where??? If to insurance for total
flying time, then I agree with that.

If you do oil changes, for example on 50 hours intervals, do you use hobbs
time or tach time? When you log engine time, do you use hobbs or tach......
I would suggest that standard practice is to use tach for either of the
above. Again, only place I know where hobbs is used is when you want to
know how long the flight was and it's directly related to the "clock" time
from engine start up to engine shutdown.

Most people log that as "their flight time", but use the tach for maint,
etc.

Alan

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2006 3:54 pm    Post subject: Powergenie - anyone using it? DIY ideas? Reply with quote

I doubt the ratio will change. For example. Unless you run at "max RPM"
the tach time will always be less than the hobbs time, not matter how long
the flight. It has to do with what the Tach registers as 100%, let's say
it's 2700, but that is also redline, then any rpm less than 2700 will be the
associated percentage less tach time than 100%... It get's a little funky
with constant speed props, but the same basically applies.

Alan

--


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brian



Joined: 02 Jan 2006
Posts: 643
Location: Sacramento, California, USA

PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2006 4:17 pm    Post subject: Powergenie - anyone using it? DIY ideas? Reply with quote

Alan K. Adamson wrote:
Quote:


I doubt the ratio will change. For example. Unless you run at "max RPM"
the tach time will always be less than the hobbs time, not matter how long
the flight.

Uh, not quite.

Quote:
It has to do with what the Tach registers as 100%, let's say
it's 2700, but that is also redline, then any rpm less than 2700 will be the
associated percentage less tach time than 100%... It get's a little funky
with constant speed props, but the same basically applies.

Actually, you will find that various mechanical recording tachometers
have different standard RPMs where the tach-time = real-time (hobbs).
Most mechanical recording tachs have their time set to be accurate at
either 2300 RPM or 2500 RPM, not redline.

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2006 4:42 pm    Post subject: Powergenie - anyone using it? DIY ideas? Reply with quote

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2006 4:47 pm    Post subject: Powergenie - anyone using it? DIY ideas? Reply with quote

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Eric M. Jones



Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 565
Location: Massachusetts

PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2006 6:26 pm    Post subject: Re: Powergenie - anyone using it? DIY ideas? Reply with quote

I hesitate to say what's inside it...the cost is modest, but furthermore the literature says it's for two cycle engines that have no oil pressure senders to use for the Hobbs job.

Using an oil pressure switch seems more reliable and easier, but what the heck--send the company your money.

For those itching to copy the thing--I very strongly suspect it is a P-fet 13V Zener shunt regulator (Just three parts!). If you know what that is, you can copy it. If you don't know what that is, probably please don't try it.


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2006 6:47 pm    Post subject: Powergenie - anyone using it? DIY ideas? Reply with quote

Ah, ha.... Ok, for you that works, for most, they use tach for maint, etc.
I only use Hobbs for recording the flight time in my log book.... But my
engine monitor will give me that numbers, so not hobbs in my airplane.

Thanks for the dialog, I didn't think many used that mechanism...

Alan

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2006 7:23 pm    Post subject: Powergenie - anyone using it? DIY ideas? Reply with quote

On 1/29/06, Alan K. Adamson <aadamson(at)highrf.com> wrote:
Quote:
This is so curious.... I've never understood the want or need for a "hobbs"
type meter in an airplane that you own. I suppose for 2 reasons. A) most
of the engine monitors of which just about everyone has no a days has one
built in; b) what information do they give you that you need. No maint that
I know of uses hobbs time, they are all tach time. And if you just need to
know how long the flight is, then get a cheap timer or wear a watch.
This is just soo odd for me... Perhaps someone can help enlighten me on this
topic?

Pretty simple reasons in my case, Alan. There is no traditional
(mechanical) tachometer installed, nor do I plan on installing one,
nor is 'tach time' recorded by the engine monitor. Sure, I could
write software for the latter but I'm quite lazy. So, in goes the
Hobbs... and I plan to log Hobbs time for everything (flight time,
engine time, prop time).

I plan to install a VDO oil pressure sender with aux 'low pressure
warning' contacts to kick the Hobbs on/off... however, I was forwarded
a link to this "magical" power lug with 3 wires stickin' out of it and
figured I'd throw it to the wolves on this list.

That's all the enlightenment I got!

D


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2006 5:18 am    Post subject: Powergenie - anyone using it? DIY ideas? Reply with quote

Good Morning All,

I haven't followed this subject thoroughly, but in the messages I have
monitored, I have seen no mention of the FARs pertinent to logging flight time.

The following is from ancient memory, please feel free to shoot it full of
holes!

My recollection is that a pilot is ALLOWED to log as pilot flight time that
time from when the aircraft moves under it's own power for the purpose of
flight until the time the aircraft is parked following the flight.

No flight time may be logged if no flight occurs, yet if you taxi out for
takeoff, encounter extensive ground delays, make a fifteen minute flight around
the pattern, decide to give it up and return to the hangar, it may take as
long as an hour or more all of which can be logged as pilot flight time.

On the other hand, you are REQUIRED to log engine and airframe time of
flight for maintenance purposes.

That has been defined by the FAA as from lift off to touch down.

Taxi time, runups and maintenance checks need not be counted as operational
time for maintenance purposes

No mechanical or electrical device is required to be available to record
either type of time.

A written log maintained by the operator is fine for all.

The FAA does allow a recording tachometer to be used as a substitute for
manually logging the time.

Other methods of logging airframe and engine time have been accepted by the
FAA such as the use of strut switches on airplanes and switches on the
collective for helicopters.

Whatever you use as a substitute for a written log is up to you, the
operator. The only FAA requirement that I recall is that the data be recorded in
some acceptable manner. What is acceptable is to be determined at the hearing!

Does that not jibe with the group's interpretation of the pertinent FARs?

Happy Skies,

Old Bob
AKA
Bob Siegfried
Ancient Aviator
Stearman N3977A
Brookeridge Air Park LL22
Downers Grove, IL 60516
630 985-8503

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In a message dated 1/29/2006 6:43:39 P.M. Central Standard Time,
lhelming(at)sigecom.net writes:

I like simplicity. I use Hobbs time for everything. That includes
maintenance cycles for changing oil. If I change it a bit early as compared
to tach time, I should be helping my engine live longer. Idle time
particularly for warm up is important especially in the winter months. I
would not think it would be good to just act as if it did not matter.
However, it is a good idea to use a consistent time system so I don't
disagree with your approach.


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