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Kellym
Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1706
Location: Sun Lakes AZ
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 Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2014 12:32 pm Post subject: Garmin Touch screen |
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Well, Dynon introduced their 10" touch screen 2 weeks ago. Major
difference....Dynon gives all nav data updates for free after you pay
initial fee for map software. Dynon offers all charts via Seattle
Avionics for $99 a year. Compare that to Garmin/Jepp update pricing. All
Dynon updates go on standard USB flash drive, no proprietary memory.
On 4/6/2014 12:19 PM, Rich Hansen wrote:
| Quote: |
In case anyone may be interested Garmin just released a new 10.6 in SV touch screen called the G3X Touch. Looks pretty cool!
Sent from my iPhone
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Kelly McMullen
A&P/IA, EAA Tech Counselor # 5286
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jesse(at)saintaviation.co
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2014 1:38 pm Post subject: Garmin Touch screen |
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And the Dynon kept all the buttons and knobs and the the touch screen functionality just make some features quicker to access. We're flying with one already and it's very very nice.
Jesse Saint
I-TEC, Inc.
jesse(at)itecusa.org
www.itecusa.org
www.mavericklsa.com
C: 352-427-0285
O: 352-465-4545
F: 815-377-3694
Sent from my iPhone
| Quote: | On Apr 6, 2014, at 4:31 PM, Kelly McMullen <kellym(at)aviating.com> wrote:
Well, Dynon introduced their 10" touch screen 2 weeks ago. Major difference....Dynon gives all nav data updates for free after you pay initial fee for map software. Dynon offers all charts via Seattle Avionics for $99 a year. Compare that to Garmin/Jepp update pricing. All Dynon updates go on standard USB flash drive, no proprietary memory.
> On 4/6/2014 12:19 PM, Rich Hansen wrote:
>
>
> In case anyone may be interested Garmin just released a new 10.6 in SV touch screen called the G3X Touch. Looks pretty cool!
>
> Sent from my iPhone
|
| | - The Matronics RV10-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
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philperry9
Joined: 23 Nov 2011
Posts: 381
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| Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2014 2:29 pm Post subject: Garmin Touch screen |
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Anyone know if it's a direct replacement for the regular button'd G3X?
Meaning can you yank the button model and using the same pin-outs for the new screens with matching screw holes, etc?
Phil
On Sun, Apr 6, 2014 at 4:35 PM, Jesse Saint <jesse(at)saintaviation.com (jesse(at)saintaviation.com)> wrote:
[quote]--> RV10-List message posted by: Jesse Saint <jesse(at)saintaviation.com (jesse(at)saintaviation.com)>
And the Dynon kept all the buttons and knobs and the the touch screen functionality just make some features quicker to access. We're flying with one already and it's very very nice.
Jesse Saint
I-TEC, Inc.
jesse(at)itecusa.org (jesse(at)itecusa.org)
www.itecusa.org
www.mavericklsa.com
C: [url=tel:352-427-0285]352-427-0285[/url]
O: [url=tel:352-465-4545]352-465-4545[/url]
F: [url=tel:815-377-3694]815-377-3694[/url]
Sent from my iPhone
> On Apr 6, 2014, at 4:31 PM, Kelly McMullen <kellym(at)aviating.com (kellym(at)aviating.com)> wrote:
>
> --> RV10-List message posted by: Kelly McMullen <kellym(at)aviating.com (kellym(at)aviating.com)>
>
> Well, Dynon introduced their 10" touch screen 2 weeks ago. Major difference....Dynon gives all nav data updates for free after you pay initial fee for map software. Dynon offers all charts via Seattle Avionics for $99 a year. Compare that to Garmin/Jepp update pricing. All Dynon updates go on standard USB flash drive, no proprietary memory.
>
>> On 4/6/2014 12:19 PM, Rich Hansen wrote:
>> --> RV10-List message posted by: Rich Hansen <karolamy(at)roadrunner.com (karolamy(at)roadrunner.com)>
>>
>> In case anyone may be interested Garmin just released a new 10.6 in SV touch screen called the G3X Touch. Looks pretty cool!
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>
>
>
>
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arget="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
===========
http://forums.matronics.com
===========
le, List Admin.
="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
===========
[b]
| | - The Matronics RV10-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
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jesse(at)saintaviation.co
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2014 2:57 pm Post subject: Garmin Touch screen |
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The new G3X is a larger screen so you will need to modify your panel. I don't know on the pin outs.
Jesse SaintI-TEC, Inc.
jesse(at)itecusa.org (jesse(at)itecusa.org)
www.itecusa.org
www.mavericklsa.com
C: 352-427-0285
O: 352-465-4545
F: 815-377-3694
Sent from my iPhone
On Apr 6, 2014, at 6:28 PM, Phillip Perry <philperry9(at)gmail.com (philperry9(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
[quote]Anyone know if it's a direct replacement for the regular button'd G3X?
Meaning can you yank the button model and using the same pin-outs for the new screens with matching screw holes, etc?
Phil
On Sun, Apr 6, 2014 at 4:35 PM, Jesse Saint <jesse(at)saintaviation.com (jesse(at)saintaviation.com)> wrote:
| Quote: | --> RV10-List message posted by: Jesse Saint <jesse(at)saintaviation.com (jesse(at)saintaviation.com)>
And the Dynon kept all the buttons and knobs and the the touch screen functionality just make some features quicker to access. We're flying with one already and it's very very nice.
Jesse Saint
I-TEC, Inc.
jesse(at)itecusa.org (jesse(at)itecusa.org)
www.itecusa.org
www.mavericklsa.com
C: [url=tel:352-427-0285]352-427-0285[/url]
O: [url=tel:352-465-4545]352-465-4545[/url]
F: [url=tel:815-377-3694]815-377-3694[/url]
Sent from my iPhone
> On Apr 6, 2014, at 4:31 PM, Kelly McMullen <kellym(at)aviating.com (kellym(at)aviating.com)> wrote:
>
> --> RV10-List message posted by: Kelly McMullen <kellym(at)aviating.com (kellym(at)aviating.com)>
>
> Well, Dynon introduced their 10" touch screen 2 weeks ago. Major difference....Dynon gives all nav data updates for free after you pay initial fee for map software. Dynon offers all charts via Seattle Avionics for $99 a year. Compare that to Garmin/Jepp update pricing. All Dynon updates go on standard USB flash drive, no proprietary memory.
>
>> On 4/6/2014 12:19 PM, Rich Hansen wrote:
>> --> RV10-List message posted by: Rich Hansen <karolamy(at)roadrunner.com (karolamy(at)roadrunner.com)>
>>
>> In case anyone may be interested Garmin just released a new 10.6 in SV touch screen called the G3X Touch. Looks pretty cool!
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>
>
>
>
===========
arget="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
===========
http://forums.matronics.com
===========
le, List Admin.
="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
===========
[b]
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carl.froehlich(at)verizon
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2014 3:22 pm Post subject: Garmin Touch screen |
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I find it amazing what good old fashion competition can produce. Garmin has
been thumbing their nose at customers for years after they bought out UPS,
their only real competitor. Now the experimental market is out building the
rest and Dynon is eating their lunch. While it is good to see Garmin trying
to gain back some of the experimental market, the lingering problem is
Garmin's grossly overpriced subscriptions and non-existent after the sale
customer service.
I can't wait for Dynon to produce their IFR certified GPS box so there is
alternative (competition) to the $10K GTN-650 stuff.
Carl
Dual 10" Dynon EFIS install
--
| | - The Matronics RV10-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
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jjessen01
Joined: 27 Sep 2010
Posts: 50
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| Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2014 3:43 pm Post subject: Garmin Touch screen |
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Doesn't Van's S-LSA ( I think that's the designation ) use the Garmin G3X? Used to be Dynon. Not a huge market, but apparently Garmin is getting some traction.
[quote] On Apr 6, 2014, at 4:22 PM, "Carl Froehlich" <carl.froehlich(at)verizon.net> wrote:
I find it amazing what good old fashion competition can produce. Garmin has
been thumbing their nose at customers for years after they bought out UPS,
their only real competitor. Now the experimental market is out building the
rest and Dynon is eating their lunch. While it is good to see Garmin trying
to gain back some of the experimental market, the lingering problem is
Garmin's grossly overpriced subscriptions and non-existent after the sale
customer service.
I can't wait for Dynon to produce their IFR certified GPS box so there is
alternative (competition) to the $10K GTN-650 stuff.
Carl
Dual 10" Dynon EFIS install
--
| | - The Matronics RV10-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
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rleffler
Joined: 05 Nov 2006
Posts: 680
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| Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2014 4:05 pm Post subject: Garmin Touch screen |
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I’ve heard this from several resources ( I haven’t personally validated yet), which means it is darn next to impossible to put two screens together using some of the third party panels. If the bezel was just  a little smaller, it would have been a better fit.  I think Garmin shot themselves in the foot on this aspect. This will be a competitive advantage for the other experimental vendors. (besides the subscription rates)
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jesse Saint
Sent: Sunday, April 06, 2014 6:50 PM
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: Garmin Touch screen
The new G3X is a larger screen so you will need to modify your panel. I don't know on the pin outs.
Jesse Saint
I-TEC, Inc.
jesse(at)itecusa.org (jesse(at)itecusa.org)
www.itecusa.org
www.mavericklsa.com
C: 352-427-0285
O: 352-465-4545
F: 815-377-3694
Sent from my iPhone
On Apr 6, 2014, at 6:28 PM, Phillip Perry <philperry9(at)gmail.com (philperry9(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
| Quote: |
Anyone know if it's a direct replacement for the regular button'd G3X?
Meaning can you yank the button model and using the same pin-outs for the new screens with matching screw holes, etc?
Phil
On Sun, Apr 6, 2014 at 4:35 PM, Jesse Saint <jesse(at)saintaviation.com (jesse(at)saintaviation.com)> wrote:
--> RV10-List message posted by: Jesse Saint <jesse(at)saintaviation.com (jesse(at)saintaviation.com)>
And the Dynon kept all the buttons and knobs and the the touch screen functionality just make some features quicker to access. We're flying with one already and it's very very nice.
Jesse Saint
I-TEC, Inc.
jesse(at)itecusa.org (jesse(at)itecusa.org)
www.itecusa.org
www.mavericklsa.com
C: [url=tel:352-427-0285]352-427-0285[/url]
O: [url=tel:352-465-4545]352-465-4545[/url]
F: [url=tel:815-377-3694]815-377-3694[/url]
Sent from my iPhone
| Quote: | On Apr 6, 2014, at 4:31 PM, Kelly McMullen <kellym(at)aviating.com (kellym(at)aviating.com)> wrote:
--> RV10-List message posted by: Kelly McMullen <kellym(at)aviating.com (kellym(at)aviating.com)>
Well, Dynon introduced their 10" touch screen 2 weeks ago. Major difference....Dynon gives all nav data updates for free after you pay initial fee for map software. Dynon offers all charts via Seattle Avionics for $99 a year. Compare that to Garmin/Jepp update pricing. All Dynon updates go on standard USB flash drive, no proprietary memory.
> On 4/6/2014 12:19 PM, Rich Hansen wrote:
> --> RV10-List message posted by: Rich Hansen <karolamy(at)roadrunner.com (karolamy(at)roadrunner.com)>
>
> In case anyone may be interested Garmin just released a new 10.6 in SV touch screen called the G3X Touch. Looks pretty cool!
>
> Sent from my iPhone
|
===========
arget="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
===========
http://forums.matronics.com
===========
le, List Admin.
="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
===========
|
01234567890123456
[quote][b]
| | - The Matronics RV10-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List |
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Bob Leffler
N410BL - Phase I
http://mykitlog.com/rleffler |
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stein(at)steinair.com
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2014 4:06 pm Post subject: Garmin Touch screen |
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To be fair (and I'm a dealer for both who sells a lot of both along with GRT
and AFS), you need to keep the comparisons apples to apples (or as close as
you can get because you can't really do an identical comparison)...
I'm not aware of either company using "proprietary memory". Dynon uses USB
on the back of the screen (or in the panel with an optionally purchased USB
extension), Garmin uses standard SD (standard computer/camera/tablet, etc..)
cards in the front of the screen. That said, USB drives though more bulky,
are slightly less expensive (not a bunch though) on a $/Gig basis.
The "Free" Dynon data costs you $500 to turn on (and an extra $250 if you
want their GPS), then you are correct that the data is only $99.00 per year.
The equivalent data (as close as you can get for that package) from Garmin
does cost more at $149 per year, but there is no 'activation' for the
mapping, and their GPS is built in (but you have to buy an antenna for $99).
As far as I know, Jepp data is optional for both systems and not required
for either system.
Also note that if you have a Garmin IFR GPS in the plane that you intend to
buy data for, then you can purchase a bundled package which saves quite a
bit of money on the IFR subscription that you might purchase anyway.
To Jesse's point about the G3X Touch size, it is the same height, but a
different width. While bigger on its own, it is slightly narrower than 2
single small screens placed side by side.
It is a pin for pin replacement, you can yank out the old and plug in the
new. That said, unlike Dynon where you can share a small and a big screen,
at this time Garmin will only work with all big screens or all small screen.
No mixing and matching as of yet, though with the built in Bluetooth who
knows what might come down the road.
They are both great systems of which we sell a bunch (and note that folks
loves the brand they have, especially if they are a dealer for only one of
them), but one needs to keep the facts straight if you're going to compare
them objectively. If one solution were a perfect fit for everyone, then I
wouldn't still carry AFS, Dynon, GRT, Garmin, TruTrak, Trio, PS Engineering,
etc... It's pretty tough to make a statement that is an absolute which
would cover each person's scenario/mission/budget/desires/needs, etc..
Then there is the extraneous stuff you need to buy to actually make the
systems work, along with the stuff that you buy because you want them (like
ADSB boxes, radios, transponders, intercoms, etc..). There are pricing and
functional differences there too that you should take into account when
looking at the whole picture.
To Carl's point about customer service, it would be better to use first-hand
feedback from folks who actually have the system in question, instead of
using hyperbole based on (certified products, portables, or...?). Different
team, different support network, different systems. Also, if you paid $10K
for an IFR GTN, then you paid too much - they have often been on sale for
less than $9K - which I agree is still expensive!  The $3995 alternative
is a decent choice right now, and I think you'll find Dynon has little
interest in making a certified GPS as they have publically stated several
times - the cost verses ROI just isn't there. It took Garmin around 15
years to sell 100K of those things, so getting payback on the many, many
millions in NRE is something most folks just don't to spread out over a
decade or so. That said, I'm betting Dynon still has a LOT to show and do in
this market!
The Vans SLSA currently uses the Skyview system, though you probably noticed
their E-LSA at SnF with a Dual G3X system installed. Currently that's the
only way to get a dual screen system in an RV-12, though I'm betting that
might change. I'm also betting that at some point this might be an option
in the S-LSA (in order to be competitive with other SLSA's like CubCrafters,
FlightDesigns, Tecnam, etc.. who have the G3X in them).
I like healthy debate as much as the next guy, but I just like to remain
objective as possible - which is difficult when discussing a subjecting
thing like this! I'm glad there is more than one, and there needs to be more
than one. If either company takes 100% of the market then it's a bad thing,
no matter who the company is. I'm sure neither one of them wants to hear
that, but it's the truth...and it wouldn't be advantageous for either
company to quit playing in this market for us as homebuilders. Having this
much strong competition is really quite good for us as builders.
Just my 2 cents as usual.
Cheers,
Stein
--
| | - The Matronics RV10-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List |
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jjessen01
Joined: 27 Sep 2010
Posts: 50
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| Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2014 4:17 pm Post subject: Garmin Touch screen |
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Stein, in your (excellent) reply below, you mentioned a $3,995 "alternative" is a decent choice over the $9k GTN. What were you referring to? An IFR panel mounted GPS? Which would that be?
Thanks,
John J
[quote] On Apr 6, 2014, at 5:05 PM, "Stein Bruch" <stein(at)steinair.com> wrote:
To be fair (and I'm a dealer for both who sells a lot of both along with GRT
and AFS), you need to keep the comparisons apples to apples (or as close as
you can get because you can't really do an identical comparison)...
I'm not aware of either company using "proprietary memory". Dynon uses USB
on the back of the screen (or in the panel with an optionally purchased USB
extension), Garmin uses standard SD (standard computer/camera/tablet, etc..)
cards in the front of the screen. That said, USB drives though more bulky,
are slightly less expensive (not a bunch though) on a $/Gig basis.
The "Free" Dynon data costs you $500 to turn on (and an extra $250 if you
want their GPS), then you are correct that the data is only $99.00 per year.
The equivalent data (as close as you can get for that package) from Garmin
does cost more at $149 per year, but there is no 'activation' for the
mapping, and their GPS is built in (but you have to buy an antenna for $99).
As far as I know, Jepp data is optional for both systems and not required
for either system.
Also note that if you have a Garmin IFR GPS in the plane that you intend to
buy data for, then you can purchase a bundled package which saves quite a
bit of money on the IFR subscription that you might purchase anyway.
To Jesse's point about the G3X Touch size, it is the same height, but a
different width. While bigger on its own, it is slightly narrower than 2
single small screens placed side by side.
It is a pin for pin replacement, you can yank out the old and plug in the
new. That said, unlike Dynon where you can share a small and a big screen,
at this time Garmin will only work with all big screens or all small screen.
No mixing and matching as of yet, though with the built in Bluetooth who
knows what might come down the road.
They are both great systems of which we sell a bunch (and note that folks
loves the brand they have, especially if they are a dealer for only one of
them), but one needs to keep the facts straight if you're going to compare
them objectively. If one solution were a perfect fit for everyone, then I
wouldn't still carry AFS, Dynon, GRT, Garmin, TruTrak, Trio, PS Engineering,
etc... It's pretty tough to make a statement that is an absolute which
would cover each person's scenario/mission/budget/desires/needs, etc..
Then there is the extraneous stuff you need to buy to actually make the
systems work, along with the stuff that you buy because you want them (like
ADSB boxes, radios, transponders, intercoms, etc..). There are pricing and
functional differences there too that you should take into account when
looking at the whole picture.
To Carl's point about customer service, it would be better to use first-hand
feedback from folks who actually have the system in question, instead of
using hyperbole based on (certified products, portables, or...?). Different
team, different support network, different systems. Also, if you paid $10K
for an IFR GTN, then you paid too much - they have often been on sale for
less than $9K - which I agree is still expensive! The $3995 alternative
is a decent choice right now, and I think you'll find Dynon has little
interest in making a certified GPS as they have publically stated several
times - the cost verses ROI just isn't there. It took Garmin around 15
years to sell 100K of those things, so getting payback on the many, many
millions in NRE is something most folks just don't to spread out over a
decade or so. That said, I'm betting Dynon still has a LOT to show and do in
this market!
The Vans SLSA currently uses the Skyview system, though you probably noticed
their E-LSA at SnF with a Dual G3X system installed. Currently that's the
only way to get a dual screen system in an RV-12, though I'm betting that
might change. I'm also betting that at some point this might be an option
in the S-LSA (in order to be competitive with other SLSA's like CubCrafters,
FlightDesigns, Tecnam, etc.. who have the G3X in them).
I like healthy debate as much as the next guy, but I just like to remain
objective as possible - which is difficult when discussing a subjecting
thing like this! I'm glad there is more than one, and there needs to be more
than one. If either company takes 100% of the market then it's a bad thing,
no matter who the company is. I'm sure neither one of them wants to hear
that, but it's the truth...and it wouldn't be advantageous for either
company to quit playing in this market for us as homebuilders. Having this
much strong competition is really quite good for us as builders.
Just my 2 cents as usual.
Cheers,
Stein
--
| | - The Matronics RV10-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List |
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stein(at)steinair.com
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2014 4:25 pm Post subject: Garmin Touch screen |
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Size wise the Garmin screen is ¾” taller (which is the same as the smaller G3X screens currently in the market), and ½” wider than the Dynon 10” screen...
Pinouts are the same.
Cheers,
Stein
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Leffler
Sent: Sunday, April 06, 2014 6:45 PM
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RE: Garmin Touch screen
I’ve heard this from several resources ( I haven’t personally validated yet), which means it is darn next to impossible to put two screens together using some of the third party panels. If the bezel was just a little smaller, it would have been a better fit. I think Garmin shot themselves in the foot on this aspect. This will be a competitive advantage for the other experimental vendors. (besides the subscription rates)
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com) [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com)] On Behalf Of Jesse Saint
Sent: Sunday, April 06, 2014 6:50 PM
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com (rv10-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: Garmin Touch screen
The new G3X is a larger screen so you will need to modify your panel. I don't know on the pin outs.
Jesse Saint
I-TEC, Inc.
jesse(at)itecusa.org (jesse(at)itecusa.org)
www.itecusa.org
www.mavericklsa.com
C: 352-427-0285
O: 352-465-4545
F: 815-377-3694
Sent from my iPhone
On Apr 6, 2014, at 6:28 PM, Phillip Perry <philperry9(at)gmail.com (philperry9(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
| Quote: |
Anyone know if it's a direct replacement for the regular button'd G3X?
Meaning can you yank the button model and using the same pin-outs for the new screens with matching screw holes, etc?
Phil
On Sun, Apr 6, 2014 at 4:35 PM, Jesse Saint <jesse(at)saintaviation.com (jesse(at)saintaviation.com)> wrote:
--> RV10-List message posted by: Jesse Saint <jesse(at)saintaviation.com (jesse(at)saintaviation.com)>
And the Dynon kept all the buttons and knobs and the the touch screen functionality just make some features quicker to access. We're flying with one already and it's very very nice.
Jesse Saint
I-TEC, Inc.
jesse(at)itecusa.org (jesse(at)itecusa.org)
www.itecusa.org
www.mavericklsa.com
C: [url=tel:352-427-0285]352-427-0285[/url]
O: [url=tel:352-465-4545]352-465-4545[/url]
F: [url=tel:815-377-3694]815-377-3694[/url]
Sent from my iPhone
| Quote: | On Apr 6, 2014, at 4:31 PM, Kelly McMullen <kellym(at)aviating.com (kellym(at)aviating.com)> wrote:
--> RV10-List message posted by: Kelly McMullen <kellym(at)aviating.com (kellym(at)aviating.com)>
Well, Dynon introduced their 10" touch screen 2 weeks ago. Major difference....Dynon gives all nav data updates for free after you pay initial fee for map software. Dynon offers all charts via Seattle Avionics for $99 a year. Compare that to Garmin/Jepp update pricing. All Dynon updates go on standard USB flash drive, no proprietary memory.
> On 4/6/2014 12:19 PM, Rich Hansen wrote:
> --> RV10-List message posted by: Rich Hansen <karolamy(at)roadrunner.com (karolamy(at)roadrunner.com)>
>
> In case anyone may be interested Garmin just released a new 10.6 in SV touch screen called the G3X Touch. Looks pretty cool!
>
> Sent from my iPhone
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stein(at)steinair.com
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| Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2014 4:26 pm Post subject: Garmin Touch screen |
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Ooops...sorry, I forgot that! That would be the GNS-400W panel mount IFR
GPS - though that price is the bundled price with a G3X which I also forgot
to add. Too much for my Sunday afternoon brain to remember. Being our first
60degree day of the year has me all giddy!
Cheers,
Stein
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gary(at)bendun.net
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| Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2014 5:28 pm Post subject: Garmin Touch screen |
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The unit in question is the Garmin GPS 400W (at) $ 3,995. It does NOT include
NAV/COM. So add another $4,495 to that for a NAV/COM unit and now you are in
GTN 650 territory. Yes, Dynon offers a COM unit (as does AFS and others) but
they tend to be 6 WATT transmitters compared to the 10 WATT (16 optional)
Garmin offering. Adding a NAV radio means sticking with the big-name brands
and price-tag.
So far, my plane will have Dynon touch-screens, PS Audio, Garmin GTN 650
(built-in NAV/COM) with a second Garmin GTR 200 COM ($ 1,200 but is 10
WATT).
Gary Bennett
http://bendun.net/
http://photos.bendun.net/
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deej(at)deej.net
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Bob Turner
Joined: 03 Jan 2009
Posts: 885
Location: Castro Valley, CA
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| Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2014 6:06 pm Post subject: Re: Garmin Touch screen |
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There are lots of good nav/coms for less than $4500.
My political objection to Garmin is that, for reasons already mentioned including the buy out of UPS (which imho should never have been allowed) they have a virtual monopoly on ifr gps - and by offering a good price on the 400W but only to G3 buyers they are using their monopoly to buy their way into the EAB EFIS market.
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carl.froehlich(at)verizon
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| Posted: Mon Apr 07, 2014 4:29 am Post subject: Garmin Touch screen |
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Gary,
Make sure you ask for the special communication software mod if you use a PS
audio panel with the GTN-650. This was the second of three surprises I had
in with my GTN-650 install - and that I had to pay for out of my pocket.
WRT the Dynon 6 watt transceiver. I have one as Comm #2. Without an
instrumented range I suspect you will never see/hear a difference in
operation between 6 and 10 watt outputs. I have one in my RV-10 as Comm #2
and like it. I'll use it in the upcoming RV-8 as well.
Carl
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rleffler
Joined: 05 Nov 2006
Posts: 680
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| Posted: Mon Apr 07, 2014 5:18 am Post subject: Garmin Touch screen |
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Carl,
Please elaborate on this and the other surprises you experienced with the gtn650 install.
My surprise was the connector illustrations for p1004 was mislabeled in rev 4,5,&6 of the aml-stc install manual causing the connector to be wired backward.
I just started experiencing a squelch issue on my 650 that wasn't there before Garmin repaired the unit.
Sent from my iPhone
On Apr 7, 2014, at 8:24 AM, "Carl Froehlich" <carl.froehlich(at)verizon.net> wrote:
Gary,
Make sure you ask for the special communication software mod if you use a PS
audio panel with the GTN-650. This was the second of three surprises I had
in with my GTN-650 install - and that I had to pay for out of my pocket.
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gary(at)bendun.net
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| Posted: Mon Apr 07, 2014 5:29 am Post subject: Garmin Touch screen |
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RE: 6 watt vs 10 watt. No matter what, line-of-sight is always going to be
the limiting factor, but some places (like most of Canada where I live)
don't have ATC repeater stations every 10 miles. Lots of times I can hear
ATC but they can't hear me.
If you can get 10 watts for the same price as 6 watts, why wouldn't you?
Garmin GTR 200 is only $ 1,195.00
Some of the issues surrounding which brands go into your panel has much to
do with which are compatible with the features of your EFIS system. I have
not yet finished my study, but so far, reading any of the installation
guides for Dynon, Garmin and AFS will give you a list of compatible products
that can be operated from the efis system. Ie: frequency tuning (NAV and
COM), transponder, etc. It seems that most show a list of Garmin gear, and
not much else.
A more rare feature is the ability for flight plans to cross-populate
between EFIS and IFR GPS Navigator. AFS has that feature now, Dynon and G3X
don't.
The other issue is panel space. Yes, you can buy a cheap COM only and a
separate VAL AVIONICS NAV, but now there are 2 boxes to find holes for. I
would much prefer a single NAV/COM unit.
Gary Bennett
http://bendun.net/
http://photos.bendun.net/
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carl.froehlich(at)verizon
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| Posted: Mon Apr 07, 2014 6:16 am Post subject: Garmin Touch screen |
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My GTN-650 problems:
#1: Configuration module not provided (long story). I would not expect others to have this problem.
#2: This comm software fix. This is/was a known problem with the GTN series: http://garmin.blogs.com/files/1123.pdf Perhaps this is now fixed in production - don't know. I was an early buyer.
#3: The 650 went dark from time to time, then restarted itself a few seconds later. Unit sent back to Garmin for repair. Has worked since.
There is another known problem with the GTN-650 regarding interference between the communications section and the GPS receiver. Here is a note I got from the avionics shop on this problem:
One other thing I have seen. Transmitting with the comm causes a weird loop effect in the ELT antenna/coax and this knocks out the GPS. Try disconnecting the ELT coax and see if that solves it.
So in other words, doing a GPS approach and transmitting on the GTN-650 radio caused the GPS signals to drop out and you get the “abort approach” message. In my install I also noted a significant degrade in NAV signal when transmitting on the 650.
For my install the ELT had nothing to do with the problem. I did find the problem gone when I replace the installed MicroAir transceiver (comm #2) with the Dynon radio (the MicroAir was my temporary comm #2 while waiting for the Dynon radio to come out). After this change the GPS and NAV signal degrade was gone. I note the GTN-650 GPS and Nav signals were not degraded when transmitting on the MicroAir. So the MicroAir in receive mode somehow feed back into the GTN-650 GPS and NAV receivers when the 650 transmitted, even though the MicroAir was not transmitting.
So for the good news. Now after all the issues are resolved the GTN-650 works as advertised. The only lingering issue is the overpriced annual data base subscription.
Carl
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stein(at)steinair.com
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| Posted: Mon Apr 07, 2014 6:38 am Post subject: Garmin Touch screen |
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Are you sure about that? I am not aware of any EFIS or device that can
"push" a flightplan from the EFIS over to one of the certified Garmin
GPSes....at least the AFS in our RV7 won't do that to the 430W. That said
pretty much all of them will accept the flightplans/approaches FROM the IFR
GPS over to the EFIS.
Also note that the remote mount version of the GTR-200 (GTR-20) is even
cheaper at $995.
Cheers,
Stein
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napolin(at)me.com
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| Posted: Mon Apr 07, 2014 8:08 am Post subject: Garmin Touch screen |
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Actualy I was talking to a Garmin rep about that yesterday at Sun-n-Fun and his response was that the FAA wont allow a certified IFR gps to receive a flight plan from another device.
Nikolaos Napoli
[quote] On Apr 7, 2014, at 10:37 AM, Stein Bruch <stein(at)steinair.com> wrote:
Are you sure about that? I am not aware of any EFIS or device that can
"push" a flightplan from the EFIS over to one of the certified Garmin
GPSes....at least the AFS in our RV7 won't do that to the 430W. That said
pretty much all of them will accept the flightplans/approaches FROM the IFR
GPS over to the EFIS.
Also note that the remote mount version of the GTR-200 (GTR-20) is even
cheaper at $995.
Cheers,
Stein
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