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jack.cunniff(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Wed Jul 26, 2006 3:37 am Post subject: Hello world...

Roll call, please?



-Jack Cunniff

'72 Arrow, Norwood, MA

Piper(at) reference from another email list

jdingbaum(at)GMAIL.COM
Guest

Posted: Wed Jul 26, 2006 4:05 am Post subject: Hello world...

On 7/26/06, Jack Cunniff <jack.cunniff(at)gmail.com (jack.cunniff(at)gmail.com)> wrote: 	  Quote: 	
		   --> Piper-List message posted by: "Jack Cunniff" <jack.cunniff(at)gmail.com (jack.cunniff(at)gmail.com)>



Roll call, please?



-Jack Cunniff

'72 Arrow, Norwood, MA

Piper(at) reference from another email list 	


Jeff Dingbaum

68 PA-28-180

NW Chicago suburbs



leaving for Oshkosh in the minivan in 15 minutes.



Jeff

jack.cunniff(at)GMAIL.COM
Guest

Posted: Wed Jul 26, 2006 4:16 am Post subject: Hello world...

have fun, Jeff. We'll keep the home fires burning.



-Jack



On 7/26/06, Jeff Dingbaum <jdingbaum(at)gmail.com> wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   On 7/26/06, Jack Cunniff <jack.cunniff(at)gmail.com> wrote:



 >

 



 Roll call, please?



 -Jack Cunniff

 '72 Arrow, Norwood, MA

 Piper(at) reference from another email list

 Jeff Dingbaum

 68 PA-28-180

 NW Chicago suburbs



 leaving for Oshkosh in the minivan in 15 minutes.



 Jeff

rbell(at)hpavet.com
Guest

Posted: Wed Jul 26, 2006 6:13 am Post subject: Hello world...

Imagine running it to you here, Jack.  I think your's is probably the second

post on this list this year.  



Ron Bell

C-172 Ashland, VA



--

jack.cunniff(at)GMAIL.COM
Guest

Posted: Wed Jul 26, 2006 12:11 pm Post subject: Hello world...

Hey, Ron.



But as has been pointed out, even this type of chit-chat isn't

appropriate, re the charter for this listserv. I'll stay tuned, but I

think that it's not the right listserv for the conversations we

have...



(healthcare, politics, financial imperialism... oh, and Oshkosh are

the current topics on the "home" list... and it really doesn't belong

on the Matronics list, so we've got to take it elsewhere.)



Good to see you here, though!



-Jack



On 7/26/06, Ron Bell <rbell(at)hpavet.com> wrote:

[quote] 



 Imagine running it to you here, Jack.  I think your's is probably the second

 post on this list this year.



 Ron Bell

 C-172 Ashland, VA



 --

rbell(at)hpavet.com
Guest

Posted: Wed Jul 26, 2006 1:29 pm Post subject: Hello world...

Well, the matronics lists I've tracked all tend to be pretty focused,

although they get off track sometimes.  Of course that's where the Do Not

Archive anywhere in the message comes in.  To keep on topic, though, I think

I'll go flying tomorrow after work.  



Ron



--

ACROGUY(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Wed Jul 26, 2006 3:04 pm Post subject: Hello world...

Gosh, some activity!

  

 I'm flying a 1999 Saratoga with about 1300 hrs since new on the  engine.  It tends to blow oil all over the belly.  We're going through  a quart about every four hours.  Any ideas?

  

  

 Jack Stovall

 acroguy(at)aol.com

1pouch(at)sbcglobal.net
Guest

Posted: Wed Jul 26, 2006 3:18 pm Post subject: Hello world...

don't fill it full . leave it down a quart and it should stop .



ACROGUY(at)aol.com wrote:   	  Quote: 	
		      Gosh, some activity!

   

  I'm flying a 1999 Saratoga with about 1300 hrs since new on the engine.  It tends to blow oil all over the belly.  We're going through a quart about every four hours.  Any ideas?

   

   

  Jack Stovall

  acroguy(at)aol.com

   

	


CHAD FELDPOUCH

 FELDPOUCH AVIATION

 PHONE: (618) 267-8035

 FAX: (618) 283-7285

 EMAIL: 1pouch(at)sbcglobal.net (1pouch(at)sbcglobal.net)

jack.cunniff(at)GMAIL.COM
Guest

Posted: Wed Jul 26, 2006 3:23 pm Post subject: Hello world...

Jack, is it possible the crankcase breather tube has slipped down the

firewall and into the slipstream, and has a higher negative pressure

than is required, sucking more oily vapor from the engine than it

should?



mind you, my Arrow has an oily belly, and the installation of an m20

air/oil separator hasn't solved the problem, but that was one of the

steps I took to troubleshoot the issue.



-Jack Cunniff

N4498T, Norwood, MA



On 7/26/06, ACROGUY(at)aol.com <ACROGUY(at)aol.com> wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  



 Gosh, some activity!



 I'm flying a 1999 Saratoga with about 1300 hrs since new on the engine.  It

 tends to blow oil all over the belly.  We're going through a quart about

 every four hours.  Any ideas?

 Jack Stovall

 acroguy(at)aol.com

rbell(at)hpavet.com
Guest

Posted: Wed Jul 26, 2006 6:13 pm Post subject: Hello world...

Have you checked the breather tube?  If  it is clogged or not located correctly it could possibly blow oil.  Also,  do you fill it all the way up, or do you leave it down a quart or two?  A  couple of questions to answer your question.  

  

 Wow, this is more activity than I've seen on  this list in several years.

  

 Ron Bell

 CP-ASEL-IA, AGI

 [quote]   

   --

ACROGUY(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Wed Jul 26, 2006 6:36 pm Post subject: Hello world...

Hey Guys,

  

 Thanks for all the input!  It's a 12 quart system that we've started  only putting 10 quarts into.  The problem it that it seems to be happy (not  blowing any overboard) at 6.5 quarts. 6.5 quarts makes me waaaaay too  nervous as that doesn't seem to be enough volume for adequate cooling. (Although  the oil temp gauge shows well within the green arc)

  

 The rubber oil vent lines were extended about four inches past the cowl  opening on the bottom of the airplane so I cut them back flush......didn't  work.

  

 Again, thanks for the input.

  

 Jack Stovall

ECLarsen81(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Wed Jul 26, 2006 8:22 pm Post subject: Hello world...

Howdy,

  Ed Larsen

  Luscombe 8F, S-115

  Ypsi, MI

  

 In a message dated 7/26/2006 7:38:35 AM Eastern Daylight Time, jack.cunniff(at)gmail.com writes:

  	  Quote: 	
		  Roll call, please?



-Jack Cunniff

'72 Arrow, Norwood, MA

Kellym

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1700
Location: Sun Lakes AZ

Posted: Wed Jul 26, 2006 8:47 pm Post subject: Hello world...

Well, I'm the instigator that suggested some folks at a semi-failing 

list move over here. I own a Mooney, have worked on a Cherokee or two, 

and a few months ago conned the FAA into giving me an IA certif.



Ron Bell wrote:

[quote] 

 

 Well, the matronics lists I've tracked all tend to be pretty focused,

 although they get off track sometimes.  Of course that's where the Do Not

 Archive anywhere in the message comes in.  To keep on topic, though, I think

 I'll go flying tomorrow after work.  

 

 Ron

 

 --

_________________
Kelly McMullen
A&P/IA, EAA Tech Counselor # 5286
KCHD

rbell(at)hpavet.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Jul 27, 2006 1:58 am Post subject: Hello world...

Conned the FAA?  Boy is that an understatement.  You can't "CON" the FAA,

they only accept CASH!! <LOL>



Ron 



--

jrccea(at)bellsouth.net
Guest

Posted: Thu Jul 27, 2006 4:52 am Post subject: Hello world...

On small Continental engines, the Cub Club recommends silver soldering a  tube extension into the oil breather elbow so that extends to the midline of the  engine (2.75 inches for the Continental).  It works.  I don't know  what the dimension would need to be for the Lycoming, nor do I know if there  would be any interference or obstruction in the Lycoming.  Nor do I know  how much trouble it might be to 337 it for the Lycoming.  On a C-85-12F, it  cut the oil leakage by about 75%.

  

 [quote]   ---

jack.cunniff(at)GMAIL.COM
Guest

Posted: Thu Jul 27, 2006 5:10 am Post subject: Hello world...

On 7/26/06, ACROGUY(at)aol.com (ACROGUY(at)aol.com) <ACROGUY(at)aol.com (ACROGUY(at)aol.com)> wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		    

  

 Hey Guys, 

   

 Thanks for all the input!  It's a 12 quart system that we've started only 

 putting 10 quarts into.  The problem it that it seems to be happy (not

 blowing any overboard) at 6.5 quarts. 6.5 quarts makes me waaaaay too

 nervous as that doesn't seem to be enough volume for adequate cooling. 

 (Although the oil temp gauge shows well within the green arc) 

   

 The rubber oil vent lines were extended about four inches past the cowl

 opening on the bottom of the airplane so I cut them back flush......didn't 

 work. 

   

 Again, thanks for the input. 

   

 Jack Stovall 


	


Jack, Mike Busch has an article on AvWeb on this topic... here's a small extract:



 Blow-by is when combustion gasses pass from the combustion chamber into the crankcase, pressurizing the crank case. Oil residue is blown out the breather onto the belly. Blow-by generally is caused by worn or clogged rings, so it is a sign of more critical issues. Additionally, if the crankshaft front seal is worn the airstream can leak past the seal. This also can pressurize the crank case. The proper solution is first to assure that your rings are in decent condition with a compression test as well as a borescope exam. (Clogged rings can sometimes make for a decent compression test, so if you are using a quart of oil an hour and it is not primarily a leak, then your rings are shot regardless of a compression test. Don't fool yourself.) The next step is to be sure that oil breather lines are clear and routed properly, since many times these breather lines are never cleaned in decades and are often misrouted in the course of other maintenance. Proper routing is critical to proper operation of the breather. Given that the rings are OK, the breather lines are routed properly and the front seal is intact, using an air/oil separator is a controversial solution. If your engine is in good condition there should be no reason to need one. Be that as it may, the air/oil separator has a measure of popularity because it is an "easy" if not always successful fix to the symptom rather than a fix to the problem. Some users swear by them; others swear at them. It usually depends on the degree of blow-by you are attempting to control. It is also very installation-sensitive. If you decide to go this route, Aircraft Spruce can provide a selection of products here as well.  

This was extracted from http://www.avweb.com/news/maint/192337-1.html



-Jack

ACROGUY(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Jul 27, 2006 6:42 am Post subject: Hello world...

In a message dated 7/27/2006 8:11:57 A.M. Central Daylight Time,  jack.cunniff(at)GMAIL.COM writes:

  	  Quote: 	
		  The    proper solution is first to assure that your rings are in decent condition    with a compression test as well as a borescope exam. (Clogged rings can    sometimes make for a decent compression test, so if you are using a    quart of oil an hour and it is not primarily a leak, then your rings    are shot regardless of a compression test. Don't fool yourself.) 	


 

 Jack,

  

 The oil loss rate is about 1 quart every 4-5 hours.  If it were 1  quart every hour, it would be top overhaul time for sure.

  

 Jack

jack.cunniff(at)GMAIL.COM
Guest

Posted: Thu Jul 27, 2006 7:43 am Post subject: Hello world...

On 7/27/06, ACROGUY(at)aol.com (ACROGUY(at)aol.com) <ACROGUY(at)aol.com (ACROGUY(at)aol.com)> wrote: 	  Quote: 	
		       

  In a message dated 7/27/2006 8:11:57 A.M. Central Daylight Time,  jack.cunniff(at)GMAIL.COM (jack.cunniff(at)GMAIL.COM) writes:

  	  Quote: 	
		  The    proper solution is first to assure that your rings are in decent condition    with a compression test as well as a borescope exam. (Clogged rings can    sometimes make for a decent compression test, so if you are using a    quart of oil an hour and it is not primarily a leak, then your rings    are shot regardless of a compression test. Don't fool yourself.) 	


 



 Jack,

  

 The oil loss rate is about 1 quart every 4-5 hours.  If it were 1  quart every hour, it would be top overhaul time for sure.

  

 Jack

	




Hmmm. Well, with the hours you've got on the engine (1300 since new, and no mention of a top or other major work done), maybe this IS a signal that you've got more than a breather tube problem... but at the same time, it's not more than an inconvenience to wipe and buy more oil right now... but maybe a borescope exam wouldn't be a bad idea, if you want to spend a little more money on diagnostics. Warm fuzzies are priceless, even if you've got to spend to get 'em. 



I'd say you should be looking at the breather tube first/again/more.



All these are wild guesses - I've got no experience with the 540; my IO360 is an entirely different animal. 



Best of luck,



 -Jack

jrccea(at)bellsouth.net
Guest

Posted: Thu Jul 27, 2006 8:45 am Post subject: Hello world...

I believe this rate is within Lycomings allowable  rate of usage.

 [quote]   ---

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