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Cost to paint RV10
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weeav8ter(at)grandecom.ne
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2006 12:28 pm    Post subject: Cost to paint RV10 Reply with quote


Hello all,
 
If any of you have had your RV10 painted or have gotten an estimate on painting it, could you please share what type of price you've had?
 
Wayne Edgerton  RV10 #40336
 
 


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egodfrey(at)ameritech.net
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2006 3:28 pm    Post subject: Cost to paint RV10 Reply with quote


Wayne,
    I had asked for an estimate from Woodlake Refinishing and they mentioned about $6,000.


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jdalton77(at)comcast.net
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2006 5:18 pm    Post subject: Cost to paint RV10 Reply with quote


Boy, that seems steep for a first paint job.  My Cherokee was a little more and they spent most of their time stripping the old paint off. Of course, the RV will have nicer paint!


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carl.froehlich(at)cox.net
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2006 6:47 pm    Post subject: Cost to paint RV10 Reply with quote


Paint is expensive.  The paint itself cost me $2500 for my RV-8A (PPG Concept base coat - clear coat).
 
Carl Froehlich
RV-10 tail kit arrived last week


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Tim(at)MyRV10.com
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2006 6:51 pm    Post subject: Cost to paint RV10 Reply with quote


Too many factors come into play to judge the cost that
closely, but I personally don't think that $6K is out
of line. It somewhat depends on how much you leave to the
painter to complete. All I know is that including paint
and the 80 hours help I paid for at only $20/hr, I paid
over $3,000 to do it myself. The paint shop rate in auto
body around here is $55/hr. I know I personally must
have had 200-250 or so hours into sanding, filling,
and general painting prep. So I think it would have
to be up in the $8k price before I'd even think it
was getting out of line too far. $5k is a bargain.
Tim
do not archive
Jeff Dalton wrote:
Quote:
Boy, that seems steep for a first paint job. My Cherokee was a little
more and they spent most of their time stripping the old paint off. Of
course, the RV will have nicer paint!

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johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2006 7:21 pm    Post subject: Cost to paint RV10 Reply with quote


I can confirm the accuracy of those prices. Tom Conner in Bend does EAA
award winners for prices over $20K. It's all about the quality of the
prep and the amount of work completed by the builder. $2,000 in
materials alone is on the shy side.
John - KUAO


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K_L_Silverman(at)hotmail.
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2006 4:34 am    Post subject: Cost to paint RV10 Reply with quote


I happen to own a Paint and Interior Shop in Salisbury, NC (RUQ) and I can
tell you that to etch, alodine, water break test, high build prime and paint
with Jet Glo and a couple of stripes starts at 12k and/or if you get fancy
with Imron 6000 and clear with multiple colored stripes add about 6 to 8K
www.AircraftPaintingAndInteriors.com Aircraftpainting(at)hotmail.com
Ken Silverman


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pcondon(at)mitre.org
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2006 7:18 am    Post subject: Cost to paint RV10 Reply with quote


Check with Vans. His shop painted the RV-10 with a paint that was less
pricy then the popular brand paints. I believe the write up was in a
back issue of the RV-ATOR. The paint material cost for the paint was
less then half if I recall.


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johncleary(at)mangertonns
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2006 7:54 am    Post subject: Cost to paint RV10 Reply with quote


Ken,
Please excuse my ignorance, but what specifically do you have in mind when
you speak of "to etch, alodine, water break test", as part of the finish
painting process for an RV-10?
Thank you,
John Cleary
(Tail cone)


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K_L_Silverman(at)hotmail.
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2006 8:24 am    Post subject: Cost to paint RV10 Reply with quote


John,
To properly prepare the aircraft for painting.....first you must:
1) Wash the plane with soap and water watching how the water runs off the
surfaces "water break" just like you do when you wash the hood of your
automobile...if the water beads up around a spot....there is dirt or some
form of contaminate.
2) Acid "Etch" the metal to clean and prepare the metal for paint....you
only have a number of hours after doing this process to repaint.
3) Alodine is a corrosion proofing coating that is then applied
4) 2377 epoxy primate primer is then applied
5) Now you can apply your base coat.....we use a "high build" because it
fills in all the little cracks and spots where you have counter sunk the
rivets and gives it a 'corporate paint job" look
6) Now you can apply either a single stage polyurethane or a base coat clear
coat paint scheme......personally I love Imron6000 with clear....but who
doesn't like the best?


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indigoonlatigo(at)msn.com
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2006 10:46 am    Post subject: Cost to paint RV10 Reply with quote


I have been etching everything during dis assembly/ before riveting and then
alodining by emersion technique. I am foregoing the internal priming and
being very careful when riveting; I cover the parts of the bucking bars that
will not be contacting the rivets with plumbers tape to keep the bucking bar
from scratching up the internal structures which can and will remove the
alodine finish.
My question for the described paint technique with the inclusion of alodine
is, obviously some filling and sanding will be done and some areas of raw
metal will then be re-exposed. Is the primer, and filler okay with the
alodine application again as some of the solution will get on some of these
areas.
The emersion technique bathed the metal in the solution and it picked up the
solution well, but I notice the brush application of alodine does not seem
to work very well as the solution simple roles off the metal, so is it
really doing anything or is there another technique to use with the alodine
to get the solution to sit longer on the raw metal?
John Gonzalez 40409


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johncleary(at)mangertonns
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2006 3:29 pm    Post subject: Cost to paint RV10 Reply with quote


Ken,
Thanks, that's great.
I am particularly interested in the fact that you alodine the surface at
this late stage because I have quick build wings and fuselage. I am
alodining all surfaces in the empennage, but I thought you couldn't alodine
pieces that were joined together because of the potential for alodine to
remain in the joints due to capillary and hence cause corrosion problems
down the track.
How specifically do you use the alodine to get the benefits and not the
problems?
Thanks,
John


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johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2006 6:48 pm    Post subject: Cost to paint RV10 Reply with quote


John -
At the airlines, we always acid wash the aluminum with phosphoric acid
then copious amounts of deionized water before the Alodine application
process. I have attached passages which might apply to our RV-10
process.
"Touch-up Alodine" is used with a handheld container much like a magic
marker to apply spot application.
You can disregard Section 3 - as the RV-10 is not yet fabricated using
any Titanium or associated alloys. Well maybe some scrap parts will be
fabricated on mine.
Our issue is, was and will remain the delaminating effects of Jet A and
Skydrol (phosphate ester based brake fluid) on the final topcoat.
Neither is a factor with the RV-10 using Avgas or H5606.
Using the correct primer for adhesion to the treated aluminum which is
also compatible with the final topcoat is critical. Changing
manufacturers is never done between primer and topcoat. I think it is
the secret formulas and special pricing that frightens us.
All Amphibians, all military and all commercials get Alodine. Cheaper
cost Spam cans skip the step cause the insidious damage is not obvious
till the product liability coverage lapses. Many kitbuilders skip this
important step (In my opinion) to save dollars. Just like using
automotive vs. aerospace hardware and electrical connectors. Risk /
Reward analysis.
Personally I would not purchase nor recommend any client buy another
builder's kitbuilt aircraft that was not alodined. Just one of many
corners cut on the road to perfection. Keep up the extra consideration
and effort.
John - KAUO
DO NOT ARCHIVE


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Tim(at)MyRV10.com
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2006 6:19 am    Post subject: Cost to paint RV10 Reply with quote


I stuck this, plus the attachments, in the tips section of my
site so that the dialup users don't have to deal with the
huge attachments.
I was going to crack a joke like "dialup...I didn't think anyone
still used dialup"....but then I remembered how awful it feels
to be stuck on dialup...so, I'd never say anything like that. Wink
Tim
Tim Olson -- RV-10 #40170
DO NOT ARCHIVE
John W. Cox wrote:
Quote:
John -
At the airlines, we always acid wash the aluminum with phosphoric acid
then copious amounts of deionized water before the Alodine application
process. I have attached passages which might apply to our RV-10
process.

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indigoonlatigo(at)msn.com
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2006 10:26 am    Post subject: Cost to paint RV10 Reply with quote


Thank you John for the very informative information. This is the kind of
information I find comforting. This is what the home build community needs.
I am a very A. retentive dentist who is trying to build his aircraft the
same way I do my dentistry. I am also an avid CC soaring pilot who owns his
own sailplane. Building the 10 has been a challenge in its departure from
perfectly smooth contours as in seeing the light refractions that occur to
the skins once they are riveted or those occasional flaws that can occur
with the bucking bar. If only the ribs could be made from CNC machines with
perfect shapes/more rigidity and as light in weight as they currently are,
that would keep guess work out of the flange bend angles out of the
equation.
I found it annoying the way in which we put in the nose ribs in the HS as
the skins were unsupported from their final shape so that the skins picked
up slack in the nose rib area when rivetted. I ended up taking a suggestion
of doing a wet shim bonding of the nose ribs, letting them bond in and one
week later rivetting them.
I am only slightly crazy as I know many of you will probably think I should
have done an all glass ship, but I do realize I am compromising those
contours and in the long run with regards to my building location, I am
saving my family's health by building the RV.
Oh, I am having fun too.
Some might find my web site interesting as long as you look under the other
interest section and read the short narative and click on the photos to see
my composite work outside of dentistry.
Building airplanes is much more fun the being down in the mouth!
Thanks,
John G. 40409
www.johngonzalezdds.com
Quote:
From: "John W. Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com>
Reply-To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
To: <rv10-list(at)matronics.com>
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Cost to paint RV10
Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2006 18:47:34 -0800
John -
At the airlines, we always acid wash the aluminum with phosphoric acid
then copious amounts of deionized water before the Alodine application
process. I have attached passages which might apply to our RV-10
process.
"Touch-up Alodine" is used with a handheld container much like a magic
marker to apply spot application.
You can disregard Section 3 - as the RV-10 is not yet fabricated using
any Titanium or associated alloys. Well maybe some scrap parts will be
fabricated on mine.
Our issue is, was and will remain the delaminating effects of Jet A and
Skydrol (phosphate ester based brake fluid) on the final topcoat.
Neither is a factor with the RV-10 using Avgas or H5606.
Using the correct primer for adhesion to the treated aluminum which is
also compatible with the final topcoat is critical. Changing
manufacturers is never done between primer and topcoat. I think it is
the secret formulas and special pricing that frightens us.
All Amphibians, all military and all commercials get Alodine. Cheaper
cost Spam cans skip the step cause the insidious damage is not obvious
till the product liability coverage lapses. Many kitbuilders skip this
important step (In my opinion) to save dollars. Just like using
automotive vs. aerospace hardware and electrical connectors. Risk /
Reward analysis.
Personally I would not purchase nor recommend any client buy another
builder's kitbuilt aircraft that was not alodined. Just one of many
corners cut on the road to perfection. Keep up the extra consideration
and effort.
John - KAUO
DO NOT ARCHIVE

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ricksked(at)earthlink.net
Guest





PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2006 11:45 am    Post subject: Cost to paint RV10 Reply with quote


Hey Doc, you should have an upper hand over the rest of us fixing those small "smileys" in your skin from the rivet gun/bucking bar Wink
Rick S.
40185
Fuselage
do not archive


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indigoonlatigo(at)msn.com
Guest





PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2006 1:39 pm    Post subject: Cost to paint RV10 Reply with quote


The problem is not making so that you don't see them, it me knowing that
they will always be there, underneath it. I think it is a sickness, but I
think I'll get over it.
I guess one way to look at it is, I don't have to worry about my first
dent...its already happened!
Thanks!
Quote:
From: Rick <ricksked(at)earthlink.net>
Reply-To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Cost to paint RV10
Date: Thu, 5 Jan 2006 11:45:35 -0800 (GMT-08:00)
Hey Doc, you should have an upper hand over the rest of us fixing those
small "smileys" in your skin from the rivet gun/bucking bar Wink
Rick S.
40185
Fuselage
do not archive


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jhasbrouck(at)woh.rr.com
Guest





PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2006 2:57 pm    Post subject: Cost to paint RV10 Reply with quote


John,
We're both afflicted with the same disease (s). Dentistry and building
an RV-10. I feel your pain. ( no pun intended )
John Hasbrouck DDS
#40264 Wings finished!


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Tdawson(at)avidyne.com
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2006 3:02 pm    Post subject: Cost to paint RV10 Reply with quote


Hey, do y'all give discounts to other -10 builders for dental work?
: )
TDT
Do not archive


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jhasbrouck(at)woh.rr.com
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2006 3:45 pm    Post subject: Cost to paint RV10 Reply with quote


Sure, I'll make you a deal. hehe ( Now where'd I put that Chelton price
list?)
John Hasbrouck


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