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Is there M39029/63-3XX For 18 AWG Wire?!?!?

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billhuntersemail(at)gmail
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Posted: Sun Apr 09, 2017 6:04 am Post subject: Is there M39029/63-3XX For 18 AWG Wire?!?!?

Hi All,

 

I am rewiring my airplane and am therefore making wire runs to the Lightspeed Plasma III ignition systems.

 

The Plasma ignition systems input connector uses DSub 15 plugs so I have utilized the M39029/63-368 crimp on connectors for all of the 20-24 AWG wires that push into the connector however I have according to the directions used an 18 AWG positive wire and an 18 AWG negative wire for the power and ground.  To make this phase of the project more dramatic, the Plasma input connector has two positive pins and two negative pins on its connector so I need to figure out to go from my single 18 AWG positive wire and divide it up into two wires that will each fit into its respective M39029/63-368 ORANGE-BLUE-GRAY crimp on connector.

 

Is there a M39029/63-3XX crimp on connector that is designed for 18 to 20 AWG wire?

 

If not, I could cut off a couple of strands of the 18 AWG wire to get it to fit into the 20 AWG connector barrel however that is not very elegant because the remaining strand(s) will kinda poke out of the wire insulation however a needle nose pliers could fix that.

 

Then the next obstacle to Plasma Bliss is dealing with dividing out the single wire and making it two wires.  

 

I am considering peeling off a 1 inch section of the insulation of the single wire about 3 inches away from the wire end and then once that section of wire is exposed, place a second wire with the insulation stripped off the end onto the exposed conductor and solder the second wire to the first and then cover the junction with heat shrink.  

 

To expose the first wire 3 inches up from the end could be possible to do by using my wire stripper to make the two cuts by just squeezing the handle only about ¼ of the way to have it cut all the way around the insulation and move the insulation about 1/16 of an inch and then exacto off the remaining center section.

 

My soldering skills have much to be desired however if I use a “second hands” type contraption to hold the two wires together and then use a clean soldering iron tip and some flux I could do a respectable job.

 

I would think that…IF…there was an easier way someone here would have found/invented it by now.

 

Also, in the past someone told me that a crimp on butt end connector creates a more secure and durable wire splice than if the two ends were soldered together.  Is that true?  Perhaps with my soldering skills that would certainly be the case however for people with decent soldering skills I am interested in the actual answer.

 

Any feedback on this idea/proper suggestions/well wishes would be most appreciated!!!

..

 

THANKS!!!

 

Bill  Hunter

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user9253

Joined: 28 Mar 2008
Posts: 1908
Location: Riley TWP Michigan

Posted: Sun Apr 09, 2017 6:38 am Post subject: Re: Is there M39029/63-3XX For 18 AWG Wire?!?!?

 	  Quote: 	
		  Also, in the past someone told me that a crimp on butt end connector creates a more secure and durable wire splice than if the two ends were soldered together.ï¿½ Is that true? 	


No, the two methods are equal.  Some might argue that soldering is better.  The disadvantage of soldering is that solder wicks into the wire and makes it stiff which could lead to breaking if subject to vibration.  But good support and a couple of layers of heat shrink will prevent that.  Crimped wires also need support.

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_________________
Joe Gores

ceengland7(at)gmail.com
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Posted: Sun Apr 09, 2017 7:22 am Post subject: Is there M39029/63-3XX For 18 AWG Wire?!?!?

On 4/9/2017 9:00 AM, William Hunter       wrote:

     

      	  Quote: 	
		                         <![endif]-->   <![endif]-->                

Hi All,         

          

I am rewiring my airplane and am             therefore making wire runs to the Lightspeed Plasma III             ignition systems.         

          

The Plasma ignition systems input             connector uses DSub 15 plugs so I have utilized the             M39029/63-368 crimp on connectors for all of the 20-24 AWG             wires that push into the connector however I have according             to the directions used an 18 AWG positive wire and an 18 AWG             negative wire for the power and ground.  To make this phase             of the project more dramatic, the Plasma input connector has             two positive pins and two negative pins on its connector so             I need to figure out to go from my single 18 AWG positive             wire and divide it up into two wires that will each fit into             its respective M39029/63-368 ORANGE-BLUE-GRAY crimp on             connector.         

          

Is there a M39029/63-3XX crimp on             connector that is designed for 18 to 20 AWG wire?         

          

If not, I could cut off a couple of             strands of the 18 AWG wire to get it to fit into the 20 AWG             connector barrel however that is not very elegant because             the remaining strand(s) will kinda poke out of the wire             insulation however a needle nose pliers could fix that.         

          

Then the next obstacle to Plasma Bliss is             dealing with dividing out the single wire and making it two             wires.           

          

I am considering peeling off a 1 inch             section of the insulation of the single wire about 3 inches             away from the wire end and then once that section of wire is             exposed, place a second wire with the insulation stripped             off the end onto the exposed conductor and solder the second             wire to the first and then cover the junction with heat             shrink.           

          

To expose the first wire 3 inches up from             the end could be possible to do by using my wire stripper to             make the two cuts by just squeezing the handle only about ¼             of the way to have it cut all the way around the insulation             and move the insulation about 1/16 of an inch and then             exacto off the remaining center section.         

          

My soldering skills have much to be             desired however if I use a “second hands” type contraption             to hold the two wires together and then use a clean             soldering iron tip and some flux I could do a respectable             job.         

          

I would think that…IF…there was an easier             way someone here would have found/invented it by now.         

          

Also, in the past someone told me that a             crimp on butt end connector creates a more secure and             durable wire splice than if the two ends were soldered             together.  Is that true?  Perhaps with my soldering skills             that would certainly be the case however for people with             decent soldering skills I am interested in the actual             answer.         

          

Any feedback on this idea/proper             suggestions/well wishes would be most appreciated!!!         

..         

          

THANKS!!!         

          

Bill  Hunter         

          

          

          

        

     	
     I think there's a drawing in 'the Book' showing how to feed a bigger     power wire into a pair (or more) of the standard pins in a subD.     It's basically what you're describing: a pair of ~6" long 20 ga     pigtails brought together & attached to the larger wire.     Soldering works great,  but if you're not confident in your skills,     a crimp style butt splice is fine, too. Solder + heat shrink is     cheaper, less bulky, and properly done, has no more risk of poor     connection or breakage from stress risers. Crimps are more     expensive, but much faster and can be achieved by 'unskilled labor'.

     

     You can split the insulation & splice in another conductor as     you describe, but if the primary is 18 ga or larger, you still have     the issue of fitting it into the 20 ga pin. Snipping strands works,     and if you keep the insulation butted against the end of the pin,     there's little danger of a short, but the whole process is a lot     more painful and risky than just using 2 20 ga pigtails.

     

     Charlie

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art(at)zemon.name
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Posted: Sun Apr 09, 2017 7:52 am Post subject: Is there M39029/63-3XX For 18 AWG Wire?!?!?

Bill,

Bob has extensive advice on how to use multiple pins in a connector for power. I documented his advice and included photos of my work (5 pins in parallel) in my blog post Wiring Harness Installed.

Â  Â  -- Art Z.



-- 

https://CheerfulCurmudgeon.com/"If I am not for myself, who is for me? And if I am only for myself, what am I? And if not now, when?" Hillel

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billhuntersemail(at)gmail
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Posted: Sun Apr 09, 2017 10:57 am Post subject: Is there M39029/63-3XX For 18 AWG Wire?!?!?

Bob, just curious... how comfortable are you with using theÂ  M39029/63-3 crimp on pins for the ignition system D-Sub connector as opposed to the solder on type?  

Thanks again,  

Bill Hunter  On Apr 9, 2017 1:42 PM, "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com (nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com)> wrote: 	  Quote: 	
		     	  Quote: 	
		  

 Electrical system 2 has the battery under the rear seat so its electrical path is from the battery POS terminal forward to the CB, to the expensive MIL spec switch mounted on the panel, and then back to the POS D-Sub pins on the ignition module mounted way back on the cold side (front) of the firewall and then from the ignition module NEG pins forward to the NEG terminal of the battery mounted under the rear seat.

 Â 

 With these long distances I felt that 18 AWG wire was a good idea. 	


 Â Â  Not very quantified . . . 



 Â Â  Resistance of 22AWG wire = 0.016 ohms/foot = 16mv drop per amp per foot of wire

 Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â  20AWG wire = 0.010 ohms/foot = 10mv drop per amp per foot of wire

 Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â  18AWG wire = 0.006 ohms/foot = 6mv drop per amp per foot of wire



 Â Â  Assume 20foot round trip from battery(+) to battery (-) and

 Â Â  2 amps of appliance draw.



 Â Â  22AWG drops 0.640 volts

 Â Â  20AWG drops 0.400 volts

 Â Â  18AWG drops 0.240 volts



 Â Â  Assuming your power pathways totaled 20 feet and

 Â Â  you indeed require 2A of supply power, voltage

 Â Â  variations presented over the range of wire

 Â Â  sizes explored above are trivial.



 Â Â  Further, LightSpeed's passion for hooking

 Â Â  things right to the battery is without president

 Â Â  in certified general aviation. The only folks

 Â Â  I know of that do this routinely are the kids

 Â Â  with 1000 Watt boom boxes in their vehicles.



 Â Â  In fact, driving BOTH systems through a common source

 Â Â  configuration violates the common sense for in the

 Â Â  analysis and mitigation of failure modes. 



 

 Â  Bob . . .

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billhuntersemail(at)gmail
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Posted: Sun Apr 09, 2017 6:29 pm Post subject: Is there M39029/63-3XX For 18 AWG Wire?!?!?

Very good and comforting information Bob. As always I am very grateful for your advice!!!  

Thanks,  

Bill Hunter  On Apr 9, 2017 7:59 PM, "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com (nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com)> wrote: 	  Quote: 	
		    At 01:55 PM 4/9/2017, you wrote:



  	  Quote: 	
		  Bob, just curious... how comfortable are you with using theÃ‚Â  M39029/63-3 crimp on pins for the ignition system D-Sub connector as opposed to the solder on type? 	


 Â  No difference. Properly installed wires

 Â  passing though quality connectors are

 Â  generally considered to have failure

 Â  rates less than one per billion flight

 Â  hours. 



 Â  I've read failure rate studies on dozens

 Â  of systems having high orders of system

 Â  criticality as demonstrated by detailed

 Â  studies of component failure rates for the

 Â  resistors, transistors, capacitors and

 Â  all manner of electro-jelly-beans. Then

 Â  they run even the simplest software

 Â  through rigorous certification and configuration

 Â  control protocols.



 Â  After all the bureaucratic thrashing dies

 Â  down you can ask: "Does this appliance have

 Â  and critical power or signal pathways that

 Â  pass through connectors?" "Of course," they

 Â  say. "But failure rates for those assemblies

 Â  are insignificant in the grand scheme of things."



 Â  For YOUR personal failure analysis consider

 Â  that you have TWO ignition systems. The engine

 Â  runs very happily on ONE system. If one system

 Â  fails, you probably won't notice it in flight

 Â  but you will at next pre-flight. Next consider

 Â  the probability that BOTH systems will go

 Â  T.U. on any single tank full of gas.



 Â  You can have terrible failure rates for each

 Â  system and still fly with confidence . . . like

 Â  we've been doing with dual magnetos for over

 Â  100 years.



 Â  If it were my airplane, one system would run

 Â  from the battery bus, the other would run

 Â  from the e-bus. Wire with single 20AWG feeders

 Â  and stay away from hooking anything directly

 Â  to the battery(ies).



 Â  It's far too easy to get wrapped around 'reliability

 Â  axles' andÂ  loose track of the real risk factors.

 Â  That's what happened with N811HB about ten years

 Â  agoÂ   http://tinyurl.com/msfmldj



 Â  KISS

 Â Â Â  



 

 

 Â  Bob . . .

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