Matronics Email Lists Forum Index Matronics Email Lists
Web Forum Interface to the Matronics Email Lists
 
 Get Email Distribution Too!Get Email Distribution Too!    FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

MP100701 Open Collector To Ground Position Sensor

 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Matronics Email Lists Forum Index -> AeroElectric-List
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
billhuntersemail(at)gmail
Guest
PostPosted: Tue Jun 13, 2017 11:34 am    Post subject: MP100701 Open Collector To Ground Position Sensor Reply with quote
Hi All,

Sorry to keep bugging you all on this topic however this is a bit over my head and you are the smartest guys in the (cyber) room and I would greatly appreciate your comments/feedback/suggestions (again).

Attached is a PDF data sheet of a sensor I think will work for my application.  Could someone PLEASE look it over and tell me IF this sensor will work with my application? 

I like this particular sensor because it is the right dimensions (length and width) for my application (I have VERY LIMITED space) and this sensor is an open collector to ground that I need for the Dynon Skyview EMS…plus it is only 15 bucks!!!


The questions I have are:

-The data sheet states “Open Collector (NPN) output can be used with bipolar or cmos logic circuits with suitable pull up resistor”.  I do not know what this means.  I want to have one of my Dynon Skyview EMS pins watch for ground on a wire.  If the pin does not see ground then the display annunciation will be dark however when the pin sees a connection to ground then the EFIS display will annunciate an “ICE” warning (it has to look for ground because I need to share this EFIS input pin with the Dynon AOA/Pitot tube heater system monitor wire.  This monitor wire is open when the pitot heater system is working correctly however when the pitot heater system fails, the system connects this monitor wire to ground).

-This sensor has three wires: Brown “VCC”, Blue “ground”, and Black “output”.  I assume the Brown wire needs to have a 5 to 12 VDC power source and the Black wire would go to my EFIS pin?

-I see where the “pull up resistor” is supposed to be installed however I do not know what value resistor to use or if it is required.

-If the sensor relies on the magnetic attraction of the target magnet and the target magnet moves away because it is mounted on the door however still attached to the air box structure is a second magnet that is located only ˝ inch next to the sensor, will that second magnet effect the operation of the switch?

-I want to use the Dynon Skyview PIN 18 as the power source for this sensor.  PIN 18 is a 5 VDC power source that is output limited to 300 mA.  I am already using that pin to power a McLagan Enterprises CS-6AB current sensor so I do not want to overtax the 300 mA output rating of the pin.  Does anyone know what the current draw of the CS-6AB (it cannot be much)

A recap on the project…I built an air filter box out of fiberglass and it has a reed type valve alternate air that is made from fiberglass and is held closed by a fiberglass spring and two magnets (one on the door and one in the fiberglass air box structure).  The design is such that should the big air filter become iced up the engine vacuum will pull against the door’s spring and the two magnets and open the door (one magnet will ride away because it is mounted on the door while the second magnet will stay attached to the air box structure).  I want to monitor the position of the door with the Dynon EFIS pin input.
..

THANKS AGAIN and I am VERY GRATEFUL for the help!!!

Bill  Hunter

- The Matronics AeroElectric-List Email Forum -
 

Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:

http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List


Extracted_page_from_1829583.pdf
 Description:

Download
 Filename:  Extracted_page_from_1829583.pdf
 Filesize:  62.1 KB
 Downloaded:  310 Time(s)
Back to top
ceengland7(at)gmail.com
Guest
PostPosted: Tue Jun 13, 2017 2:27 pm    Post subject: MP100701 Open Collector To Ground Position Sensor Reply with quote
On Tue, Jun 13, 2017 at 2:33 PM, William Hunter <billhuntersemail(at)gmail.com (billhuntersemail(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
Quote:

Hi All,
 
Sorry to keep bugging you all on this topic however this is a bit over my head and you are the smartest guys in the (cyber) room and I would greatly appreciate your comments/feedback/suggestions (again).
 
Attached is a PDF data sheet of a sensor I think will work for my application.  Could someone PLEASE look it over and tell me IF this sensor will work with my application? 
 
I like this particular sensor because it is the right dimensions (length and width) for my application (I have VERY LIMITED space) and this sensor is an open collector to ground that I need for the Dynon Skyview EMS…plus it is only 15 bucks!!!
 
 
The questions I have are:
 
-The data sheet states “Open Collector (NPN) output can be used with bipolar or cmos logic circuits with suitable pull up resistor”.  I do not know what this means.  I want to have one of my Dynon Skyview EMS pins watch for ground on a wire.  If the pin does not see ground then the display annunciation will be dark however when the pin sees a connection to ground then the EFIS display will annunciate an “ICE” warning (it has to look for ground because I need to share this EFIS input pin with the Dynon AOA/Pitot tube heater system monitor wire.  This monitor wire is open when the pitot heater system is working correctly however when the pitot heater system fails, the system connects this monitor wire to ground).
 
-This sensor has three wires: Brown “VCC”, Blue “ground”, and Black “output”.  I assume the Brown wire needs to have a 5 to 12 VDC power source and the Black wire would go to my EFIS pin?
 
-I see where the “pull up resistor” is supposed to be installed however I do not know what value resistor to use or if it is required.
 
-If the sensor relies on the magnetic attraction of the target magnet and the target magnet moves away because it is mounted on the door however still attached to the air box structure is a second magnet that is located only ½ inch next to the sensor, will that second magnet effect the operation of the switch?
 
-I want to use the Dynon Skyview PIN 18 as the power source for this sensor.  PIN 18 is a 5 VDC power source that is output limited to 300 mA.  I am already using that pin to power a McLagan Enterprises CS-6AB current sensor so I do not want to overtax the 300 mA output rating of the pin.  Does anyone know what the current draw of the CS-6AB (it cannot be much)
 
A recap on the project…I built an air filter box out of fiberglass and it has a reed type valve alternate air that is made from fiberglass and is held closed by a fiberglass spring and two magnets (one on the door and one in the fiberglass air box structure).  The design is such that should the big air filter become iced up the engine vacuum will pull against the door’s spring and the two magnets and open the door (one magnet will ride away because it is mounted on the door while the second magnet will stay attached to the air box structure).  I want to monitor the position of the door with the Dynon EFIS pin input.
..
 
THANKS AGAIN and I am VERY GRATEFUL for the help!!!
 
Bill  Hunter
 
 
 
 


Bill,
The pullup resistor is shown on that data sheet, in the schematic, which also shows all the wire connections to make it work. It should do what you want, but it's not that much smaller than many of the devices I sent earlier. It would save you (and us) a lot of time if you spell out all of your requirements, including size (dimensions) in your initial question.
If you really need small, try this:
http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/MEDER-electronic-Standex/KSK-1C90U-1015/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMvFdY0L2HfHxsLmHWXxOk2BtXfBXWgtRX0%3d

or use the google to search for 'form C reed switch'. No electronics, just a single pole, double throw magnetically activated switch (electrically, it looks just like a SPDT toggle switch). The one I linked is 'bare' and could be easily fit into a 3/8" diameter by 1" long space. 
Couple more thoughts. Do you really need two magnets? Have you checked whether the engine can actually overcome the magnets, if the inlet is blocked? (Many newer magnets are quite powerful.) If you use a long narrow magnet & just a piece of steel on the stationary side, you could probably use the same magnet to hold the door shut and activate the reed switch (mounted away from the steel, toward the other pole of the magnet).
Charlie

- The Matronics AeroElectric-List Email Forum -
 

Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:

http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List
Back to top
user9253



Joined: 28 Mar 2008
Posts: 1908
Location: Riley TWP Michigan
PostPosted: Tue Jun 13, 2017 6:15 pm    Post subject: Re: MP100701 Open Collector To Ground Position Sensor Reply with quote
The SkyView EMS has at least 9 general purpose inputs. If all of them are not already being used, then I suggest that the magnetic sensor be connected to its own discrete EMS input instead of sharing an input with the pitot heat sensor.

- The Matronics AeroElectric-List Email Forum -
 

Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:

http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List

_________________
Joe Gores
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
billhuntersemail(at)gmail
Guest
PostPosted: Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:02 pm    Post subject: MP100701 Open Collector To Ground Position Sensor Reply with quote
Thanks Bob and Charlie!!!

Quote:
Do you really need two magnets? Have you checked whether the engine can
actually overcome the magnets, if the inlet is blocked? (Many newer magnets

are quite powerful.) If you use a long narrow magnet & just a piece of
steel on the stationary side, you could probably use the same magnet to
hold the door shut and activate the reed switch (mounted away from the
steel, toward the other pole of the magnet).

This design is not exactly in BETA test at this point... perhaps more like
Charlie minus testing and the plan has changed a bit (I'm sure that I am
the only one in Aviation that has had design creep and concept validation
issues).

I really do not know how strong the magnets need to be... I know...the size
of the flapper door... the size of the main filter... the engine is 540
CID...I know that I want the door to stay closed until the air filter gets
blocked just a smidgen and then I want the flapper to pop fully open... the
indicator light will help decide how large the magnets need to be.

So... I just replaced my worn out electric sonic toothbrush and whilst
conducting the R&R procedure the two brush heads whacked together on the
counter top and got stuck together on the magnet ends and just like magic I
had a "hey what if..." moment.

These magnets are like really... REALLY small and if I place them on one
corner of the door (one magnet on the door and one on the air box
structure) then there will be about 2.5 inches of distance to the adjacent
corner where the magic switch can be installed... then perhaps there will
be enough distance to reduce any magnetic interference. I will buy this
sensor and conduct some fiddling around and report back.

Also... the original plan was to have the Dynon heater sensor on one EMS
sensor pin and the flapper door gizmo on a different pin until I ran out of
pins. Then you all suggested this fancy proximity sensor and I figured that
I could combine both ice related contraptions on a single pin and since the
Dynon sensor is a sink to ground I need a switch gizmo that will also sink
to ground...

Anyhoo.. THANKS AGAIN. It will be a couple of weeks before I can report
back.

Bill

On Jun 13, 2017 6:31 PM, "Charlie England" <ceengland7(at)gmail.com> wrote:

[quote]

On Tue, Jun 13, 2017 at 2:33 PM, William Hunter <
billhuntersemail(at)gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi All,
>
> Sorry to keep bugging you all on this topic however this is a bit over my
> head and you are the smartest guys in the (cyber) room and I would greatly
> appreciate your comments/feedback/suggestions (again).
>
> Attached is a PDF data sheet of a sensor I think will work for my
> application. Could someone PLEASE look it over and tell me IF this sensor
> will work with my application?
>
> I like this particular sensor because it is the right dimensions (length
> and width) for my application (I have VERY LIMITED space) and this sensor
> is an open collector to ground that I need for the Dynon Skyview EMS…plus
> it is only 15 bucks!!!
>
> The questions I have are:
>
> -The data sheet states “Open Collector (NPN) output can be used with
> bipolar or cmos logic circuits with suitable pull up resistor”. I do not
> know what this means. I want to have one of my Dynon Skyview EMS pins
> watch for ground on a wire. If the pin does not see ground then the
> display annunciation will be dark however when the pin sees a connection to
> ground then the EFIS display will annunciate an “ICE” warning (it has to
> look for ground because I need to share this EFIS input pin with the Dynon
> AOA/Pitot tube heater system monitor wire. This monitor wire is open when
> the pitot heater system is working correctly however when the pitot heater
> system fails, the system connects this monitor wire to ground).
>
> -This sensor has three wires: Brown “VCC”, Blue “ground”, and Black
> “output”. I assume the Brown wire needs to have a 5 to 12 VDC power source
> and the Black wire would go to my EFIS pin?
>
> -I see where the “pull up resistor” is supposed to be installed however I
> do not know what value resistor to use or if it is required.
>
> -If the sensor relies on the magnetic attraction of the target magnet and
> the target magnet moves away because it is mounted on the door however
> still attached to the air box structure is a second magnet that is located
> only ½ inch next to the sensor, will that second magnet effect the
> operation of the switch?
>
> -I want to use the Dynon Skyview PIN 18 as the power source for this
> sensor. PIN 18 is a 5 VDC power source that is output limited to 300 mA

- The Matronics AeroElectric-List Email Forum -
 

Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:

http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List
Back to top
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Matronics Email Lists Forum Index -> AeroElectric-List All times are GMT - 8 Hours
Page 1 of 1

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group