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Carb Diaphragm for HS-6A

 
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jay-dub



Joined: 31 May 2014
Posts: 78
Location: UK

PostPosted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 8:18 am    Post subject: Carb Diaphragm for HS-6A Reply with quote

Having had a very quiet moment while airborne the other day, it is likely we need a new carb diaphragm.

Our maintenance organisation has a diaphragm for the AK-14P carb. We think we need a QHQ-14A for the Huosai, which I will have to acquire.

Are they by any chance interchangeable before I email Doug S?

Thanks.


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dsavarese0812(at)bellsout
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 10:01 am    Post subject: Carb Diaphragm for HS-6A Reply with quote

They are definitely NOT interchangeable. Tried it many, many years ago when I was trying to adapt the manual mixture control from the Huosai carburetor to the M14 carburetor.
Dennis

Sent from my iPhone

Quote:
On Feb 21, 2019, at 11:18 AM, jay-dub <flyjnw(at)gmail.com> wrote:



Having had a very quiet moment while airborne the other day, it is likely we need a new carb diaphragm.

Our maintenance organisation has a diaphragm for the AK-14P carb. We think we need a QHQ-14A for the Huosai, which I will have to acquire.

Are they by any chance interchangeable before I email Doug S?

Thanks.

--------
CJ and Yak-52 owner




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jay-dub



Joined: 31 May 2014
Posts: 78
Location: UK

PostPosted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 10:15 am    Post subject: Re: Carb Diaphragm for HS-6A Reply with quote

Thanks Dennis.

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mark.bitterlich(at)navy.m
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 12:24 pm    Post subject: Carb Diaphragm for HS-6A Reply with quote

May I ask why you think you need a carb diaphragm ?? The reason I ask is simply because when one of them tears, or fails, it does not fix itself and then you fly home.

If all of a sudden you start running very rich , etc., etc., yes. Or if the engine stops running... as in it totally stops running .... yes, probably.

But if it stops in flight for a few moments and then starts running again... or something like that, it could be electrical as in mag coils. That can often be very difficult to define.

You probably know all this already, so ... sorry.

Mark
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jay-dub



Joined: 31 May 2014
Posts: 78
Location: UK

PostPosted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 12:35 pm    Post subject: Re: Carb Diaphragm for HS-6A Reply with quote

Hi Mark,

Our thoughts are as follows. I was aerobatting and came off a loop to a strong smell of fuel in the cockpit. There were no engine issues at this stage. It cleared so I thought I'd carry on. The same occurred again and the engine missed but recovered so I took the hint and went home. I pulled the power back to 68/2000 and it missed twice more on the way home so I left the levers alone as it kept recovering. I recovered to the airfield from a forced landing pattern and the engine quit during the roll out as the airflow was seemingly driving the prop during the descent, so I effectively deadsticked it in. It glides much better than a -52!! Our thought is that it rich-cut as I pulled the throttle back for the descent.

I've had a mag failure in a Yak-52 in the past which gave very similar symptoms other than there was no smell of fuel and the engine kept going after landing.

Does that sound logical? In fairness, it will be handy to keep a diaphragm in stock anyway so I don't mind picking one up.


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richard.goode(at)russiana
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 12:36 am    Post subject: Carb Diaphragm for HS-6A Reply with quote

I agree with Mark. But if you have a diaphragm/membrane failure, then after
the engine has been shut down, leave the fuel on and the throttle slightly
open, and you will almost certainly get fuel dripping down through the
carburettor. If none comes out, then I would suspect a coil failure.

I would also make the point that, very specifically, these diaphragms (and
there are two in each carburettor) should be replaced at a maximum of every
six years.

Richard

RICHARD GOODE AEROBATICS
Rhodds Farm, Lyonshall, Hereford, HR5 3LW, UK
Tel: +44 (0)1544 340120 Fax: +44 (0)1544 340129
e-mail: richard.goode(at)russianaeros.com
www.russianaeros.com
WORLD LEADERS IN RUSSIAN SPORTING AIRCRAFT & ENGINES
In partnership with Aerometal Kft, Hungary.

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romaine_richard(at)yahoo.
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 12:59 am    Post subject: Carb Diaphragm for HS-6A Reply with quote

Not sure if it works for all symptoms described, but fuel odor in cockpit could be leaking primer due to loose knurled nut on primer plunger or worn/cut plunger o-ring under knurled nut...also causing lean issues. Have you seen, smelled any fuel from top of plunger during priming?

Bonus is fixes don’t come much cheaper or easier.

Rich

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jay-dub



Joined: 31 May 2014
Posts: 78
Location: UK

PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 1:16 am    Post subject: Re: Carb Diaphragm for HS-6A Reply with quote

Always happy with a cheap fix. No evidence of that at all but we’re about to do the annual while it’s grounded so we’ll give it a good look over.

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wlannon(at)shaw.ca
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 11:35 am    Post subject: Carb Diaphragm for HS-6A Reply with quote

Hi Richard;

Is there a Russian, or other, AWD specifying a life limit for the diaphragm?
Where is the second diaphragm located?

Thanks;
Walt

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richard.goode(at)russiana
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 23, 2019 1:39 am    Post subject: Carb Diaphragm for HS-6A Reply with quote

Yes, we unfortunate Europeans are much more tightly controlled than you
lucky guys. But categorically it is a European rule from EASA (our FAA) that
the membranes (diaphragms) have a six year calendar life.

It is fairly clear from the engine manual where they are, but to help I will
ask Aerometal, our partner in Hungary, to send me photographs of the
carburettor indicating exactly the parts that needs to be removed to change
the membranes, and I will post it on the yak-list.

With regards

Richard
RICHARD GOODE AEROBATICS
Rhodds Farm, Lyonshall, Hereford, HR5 3LW, UK
Tel: +44 (0)1544 340120 Fax: +44 (0)1544 340129
e-mail: richard.goode(at)russianaeros.com
www.russianaeros.com
WORLD LEADERS IN RUSSIAN SPORTING AIRCRAFT & ENGINES
In partnership with Aerometal Kft, Hungary.

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Viperdoc



Joined: 19 Apr 2014
Posts: 463
Location: 08A

PostPosted: Sat Feb 23, 2019 5:46 am    Post subject: Carb Diaphragm for HS-6A Reply with quote

Did you say you had a heavy smell of fuel in the cockpit when this occurred?
A carb diaphragm leak is not going to give you a smell of fuel in the cockpit during flight, Level or aerobatic.
Sucking air will cause the engine to lean out and fail too.
So places to look are for places fuel can get into the cockpit. Also a mag coil failing as Mark said will cause engine hesitation. It is quite impressive when that happens. Usually 15 to 20 min into the flight and will occurs again in 15 to 20 min if the flight continues.
Doc

Sent from my iPad

[quote] On Feb 22, 2019, at 2:35 AM, Richard Goode <richard.goode(at)russianaeros.com> wrote:



I agree with Mark. But if you have a diaphragm/membrane failure, then after
the engine has been shut down, leave the fuel on and the throttle slightly
open, and you will almost certainly get fuel dripping down through the
carburettor. If none comes out, then I would suspect a coil failure.

I would also make the point that, very specifically, these diaphragms (and
there are two in each carburettor) should be replaced at a maximum of every
six years.

Richard

RICHARD GOODE AEROBATICS
Rhodds Farm, Lyonshall, Hereford, HR5 3LW, UK
Tel: +44 (0)1544 340120 Fax: +44 (0)1544 340129
e-mail: richard.goode(at)russianaeros.com
www.russianaeros.com
WORLD LEADERS IN RUSSIAN SPORTING AIRCRAFT & ENGINES
In partnership with Aerometal Kft, Hungary.

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jay-dub



Joined: 31 May 2014
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 23, 2019 10:06 am    Post subject: Re: Carb Diaphragm for HS-6A Reply with quote

I’ve had coil failure in the past. This was similar other than the smell of fuel and the engine actually quit fully. Will have a look for leaks when we get it apart.

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Harv



Joined: 01 Jul 2010
Posts: 149

PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2019 12:29 pm    Post subject: Re: Carb Diaphragm for HS-6A Reply with quote

Hi John

I replaced the diaphragm on my CJ when we rebuilt it in 2013 and it's due again now (if we are following a 6 year life) sourced via Doug S. Check with him regarding this being the only one in the HS6's carb as I believe it is. The yak52 may have other internal diaphragms or seals as from memory that carb is also pressure (alt) sensing.

Rgs
Harv


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jay-dub



Joined: 31 May 2014
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2019 2:11 pm    Post subject: Re: Carb Diaphragm for HS-6A Reply with quote

Doug is out of stock at the moment. Should be ok in a couple of weeks.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2019 2:57 pm    Post subject: Carb Diaphragm for HS-6A Reply with quote

Fuel smell in the cockpit could possibly be coming from a fractured
bellows in the wobble pump?  Maybe Walt will comment on the possibility
of that.
Dennis

A. Dennis Savarese
334-546-8182 (mobile)
www.yak-52.com
Skype - Yakguy1

On 2/25/2019 5:11 PM, jay-dub wrote:
Quote:


Doug is out of stock at the moment. Should be ok in a couple of weeks.

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n13472(at)aol.com
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2019 3:44 pm    Post subject: Carb Diaphragm for HS-6A Reply with quote

What bellows are you referring to? is this in a CJ ?
Tom Elliott
CJ-6A NX63727
777 Quartz Ave
PMB 7004
Sandy Valley NV.
89019
Cell 541-297-5497
N13472(at)AOL.COM

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2019 5:12 pm    Post subject: Carb Diaphragm for HS-6A Reply with quote

Hey Dennis;

Can't say I recall a bellows unit in the CJ wobble pump but it is years
since I've had one apart and I'm not getting smarter with advancing years.

The only fuel/bellows interface I can recall is in the Harvard/T6 fuel
control unit. This is a combined unit containing the fuel filter, the
wobble pump and a bellows type fuel pressure adjustment unit. The original
engine driven rotary fuel pump was a simple pump with no pressure adjustment
or internal bypass so the fuel unit was necessary. The wobble (emergency)
pump operated in parallel to the main system unlike the CJ which is a series
system requiring a more modern pump with internal by-pass and integral
pressure control.

Usual places for a wobble pump leak are: 1. the shaft packing seal, 2.
cover gasket & 3. fittings. But I would also take a good look for pin-hole
corrosion in the vent system anti-syphon loop which is located about 12" SW
of the pilot's nose.

Cheers;
Walt

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2019 7:21 pm    Post subject: Carb Diaphragm for HS-6A Reply with quote

Good point Harv;

As you suggested that second diaphragm will be in the auto-mixture section
of the M14P carb. With the Huosai we have only one to think about.

Walt

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