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HS-6 engine needed
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Harv



Joined: 01 Jul 2010
Posts: 155

PostPosted: Sat Jun 22, 2019 3:37 am    Post subject: HS-6 engine needed Reply with quote

Quick email for a fellow pilot and friend who is looking for a stock cj6 engine.
Pleas advise if you have a used engine with good time remaining or know where we could obtain an overhaulled unit, I guess China directly??

Thanks


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 22, 2019 6:44 am    Post subject: HS-6 engine needed Reply with quote

To the best of my knowledge but do check with Doug Sapp there is
absolutely no possibility of getting any engines, new or overhauled, out of
China in the foreseeable future. And, because of shortage of appropriate
parts, I don't believe anyone in the West is technically capable of doing a
proper overhaul on these engines, despite their great similarity to the
Russian AI14 engine.

Having said that, I'm sure there are people with a spare engine sitting at
the back of their hangar that could be available!

Richard
RICHARD GOODE AEROBATICS
Rhodds Farm, Lyonshall, Hereford, HR5 3LW, UK
Tel: +44 (0)1544 340120 Fax: +44 (0)1544 340129
e-mail: richard.goode(at)russianaeros.com
www.russianaeros.com
WORLD LEADERS IN RUSSIAN SPORTING AIRCRAFT & ENGINES
In partnership with Aerometal Kft, Hungary.
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chrisunrau



Joined: 06 Sep 2018
Posts: 4
Location: Winkler, Manitoba Canada

PostPosted: Sat Jun 22, 2019 3:09 pm    Post subject: Re: HS-6 engine needed Reply with quote

I will have a used HS-6 engine available this winter, I realize that probably doesn't help but in case you are still looking come November or December mine will most likely be available. All of this pending prop strike inspection and work to be done by M14 on my other engine. The one that would be coming available I have put on temporarily to get me through the flying season, it has about 1600 hours and good compressions, runs strong.

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marcusbates(at)att.net
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 23, 2019 1:51 pm    Post subject: HS-6 engine needed Reply with quote

I have one Housai engine that should be a good engine. It was purchased from China by my father as a zero time since overhaul. When it arrived, it was obviously not as presented. We assumed it was a + or- 600 hr. Engine. I have no logs or history on the engine, so it is being offered as is. It has mags, but no carburetor. We were going to the automotive spark plugs ignition. It has been stored in an enclosed hangar, and I am offering it as is, where is, for $3,000.00. I will palletize it and deliver to shipping company of your choice. Contact me at marcusbates(at)att.net or call 512-699-5455.

Sent from my iPad

Quote:
On Jun 22, 2019, at 6:09 PM, chrisunrau <cunrau(at)gmail.com> wrote:



I will have a used HS-6 engine available this winter, I realize that probably doesn't help but in case you are still looking come November or December mine will most likely be available. All of this pending prop strike inspection and work to be done by M14 on my other engine. The one that would be coming available I have put on temporarily to get me through the flying season, it has about 1600 hours and good compressions, runs strong.




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PostPosted: Sun Jun 23, 2019 2:18 pm    Post subject: HS-6 engine needed Reply with quote

I have the following CJ-6 parts available. Main tire, nose tire (new) , rear fuselage from just in front of the adf hole, 2 new turn and bank instruments, 2 new fuel gauges, 2 new three-in-one gauges, 2 new artificial horizons, 2 new airspeed instruments, 2 new tachometers , a pair of slightly damaged but easily repaired elevators. I have a magneto switch, used. I also have 5 sets of Yak 52 five point seat belts. There are three new, two used. Contact me for more info.

Sent from my iPad

Quote:
On Jun 23, 2019, at 4:51 PM, Marcus Bates <marcusbates(at)att.net> wrote:



I have one Housai engine that should be a good engine. It was purchased from China by my father as a zero time since overhaul. When it arrived, it was obviously not as presented. We assumed it was a + or- 600 hr. Engine. I have no logs or history on the engine, so it is being offered as is. It has mags, but no carburetor. We were going to the automotive spark plugs ignition. It has been stored in an enclosed hangar, and I am offering it as is, where is, for $3,000.00. I will palletize it and deliver to shipping company of your choice. Contact me at marcusbates(at)att.net or call 512-699-5455.

Sent from my iPad

> On Jun 22, 2019, at 6:09 PM, chrisunrau <cunrau(at)gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
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> I will have a used HS-6 engine available this winter, I realize that probably doesn't help but in case you are still looking come November or December mine will most likely be available. All of this pending prop strike inspection and work to be done by M14 on my other engine. The one that would be coming available I have put on temporarily to get me through the flying season, it has about 1600 hours and good compressions, runs strong.
>
>
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> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=489771#489771
>
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 23, 2019 6:54 pm    Post subject: HS-6 engine needed Reply with quote

Engine sold.......

Sent from my iPad

[quote] On Jun 22, 2019, at 9:44 AM, Richard Goode <richard.goode(at)russianaeros.com> wrote:



To the best of my knowledge – but do check with Doug Sapp – there is
absolutely no possibility of getting any engines, new or overhauled, out of
China in the foreseeable future. And, because of shortage of appropriate
parts, I don't believe anyone in the West is technically capable of doing a
proper overhaul on these engines, despite their great similarity to the
Russian AI14 engine.

Having said that, I'm sure there are people with a spare engine sitting at
the back of their hangar that could be available!

Richard


RICHARD GOODE AEROBATICS
Rhodds Farm, Lyonshall, Hereford, HR5 3LW, UK
Tel: +44 (0)1544 340120 Fax: +44 (0)1544 340129
e-mail: richard.goode(at)russianaeros.com
www.russianaeros.com
WORLD LEADERS IN RUSSIAN SPORTING AIRCRAFT & ENGINES
In partnership with Aerometal Kft, Hungary.


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Harv



Joined: 01 Jul 2010
Posts: 155

PostPosted: Sun Jun 23, 2019 10:10 pm    Post subject: Re: HS-6 engine needed Reply with quote

Chris, thanks for the reply.

I'll keep your details handy but end of the year maybe too far away atm unless nothing else becomes available.

Marcus that one went before we could reply but may have been a non starter as there was no paperwork, thanks all the same.

If there's anyone else with a motor for sale please email directly.
Redhillwarbirds (at) gmail.com

Cheers


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 24, 2019 2:06 am    Post subject: HS-6 engine needed Reply with quote

Well done! But of greater general interest is whether anyone can confirm that either new or overhauled engines are currently available from China? Doug Sapp seems to know everyone relevant and his view is that no engines are available!

Richard
RICHARD GOODE AEROBATICS
Rhodds Farm, Lyonshall, Hereford, HR5 3LW, UK
Tel: +44 (0)1544 340120 Fax: +44 (0)1544 340129
e-mail: richard.goode(at)russianaeros.com
www.russianaeros.com
WORLD LEADERS IN RUSSIAN SPORTING AIRCRAFT & ENGINES
In partnership with Aerometal Kft, Hungary.
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jay-dub



Joined: 31 May 2014
Posts: 91
Location: UK

PostPosted: Mon Jun 24, 2019 3:00 am    Post subject: Re: HS-6 engine needed Reply with quote

Given that the HS-6 (not the A), is effectively the AI-14, how big a step would it be to uprate one to 285hp A spec? From the little research I’ve done, it seems the only real difference is the carb.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 24, 2019 3:59 am    Post subject: HS-6 engine needed Reply with quote

According to the Russian documentation that I have, the HS-6 is "a Chinese version of the AI 14 R", which was the original Russian production engine of 1956, nominally 260 hp. Then they say that the HS-6A is a Chinese version of the AI 14 RF. This was a higher performance version, principally aimed at the Yak 18 single-seat aerobatic aircraft, and which delivered 300 hp. However they go on to say that this extra horsepower was developed only through increased rpm rather than any other modifications.

I would be confident that an AI 14 adjusted to turn at around 2550 rpm (as opposed to the very modest standard maximum of 2350 rpm) would certainly produce 285 hp. Also they had very generous tolerances for the supercharger clearances, and we have found that by decreasing these tolerances, it is easy to obtain an additional 15 or so horsepower in itself.

And of course these rpm figures are significantly less than the 2950 rpm (101%) which is the maximum for the M 14 P engine, of course essentially the same, albeit modified and strengthened.

Richard
RICHARD GOODE AEROBATICS
Rhodds Farm, Lyonshall, Hereford, HR5 3LW, UK
Tel: +44 (0)1544 340120 Fax: +44 (0)1544 340129
e-mail: richard.goode(at)russianaeros.com
www.russianaeros.com
WORLD LEADERS IN RUSSIAN SPORTING AIRCRAFT & ENGINES
In partnership with Aerometal Kft, Hungary.
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GeorgeCoy



Joined: 02 Dec 2010
Posts: 277

PostPosted: Mon Jun 24, 2019 4:59 am    Post subject: HS-6 engine needed Reply with quote

Not to change the subject ... we are looking for some HS6A mounting rings.
If anyone has any available please contact me off list.

George Coy
MotorstarNA
714 Airport Rd.
Swanton VT 05488
802-868-5633 off
802-363-5782 cell
george.coy(at)gmail.com
http://motorstarna.com/
SKYPE george.coy
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jay-dub



Joined: 31 May 2014
Posts: 91
Location: UK

PostPosted: Mon Jun 24, 2019 12:38 pm    Post subject: Re: HS-6 engine needed Reply with quote

Thanks Richard.

On that note, would “turning up” an A be feasible?

I’m currently discussing retuning our current engine as it runs very cool. It’s very rare to see more than 170C CHT so I’m assuming it’s stock tune for 70+ octane where we obviously run 100LL; so advancing by the timing seems the way to go.

A slightly different question, can I safely in addition turn up the max revs of a 6A in your opinion? 2550 on 6A should easily yield a good 300hp but at what cost in terms of parts and reliability? I know I’d still have to abide by the MP limit to avoid blowing a pot...


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Harv



Joined: 01 Jul 2010
Posts: 155

PostPosted: Mon Jun 24, 2019 12:51 pm    Post subject: Re: HS-6 engine needed Reply with quote

Interesting you mention the running cool issue (which isn’t good, although not as bad as running too hot) as out of the box mine ran too cool also and I put this down to the Chinese running them on really crap fuel ( I don’t recall the exact banding but it’s recorded in my logs) and as such then going into 100LL simply sees the stock hs6 running too rich. I’ve some hadthe carb adjusted and it seems happier with the added bonus of less fuel bur

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 24, 2019 12:53 pm    Post subject: HS-6 engine needed Reply with quote

Jay-dub,What is your fuel burn at cruise?
Doug
On Mon, Jun 24, 2019 at 1:43 PM jay-dub <flyjnw(at)gmail.com (flyjnw(at)gmail.com)> wrote:

Quote:
--> Yak-List message posted by: "jay-dub" <flyjnw(at)gmail.com (flyjnw(at)gmail.com)>

Thanks Richard.

On that note, would “turning up” an A be feasible?

I’m currently discussing retuning our current engine as it runs very cool. It’s very rare to see more than 170C CHT so I’m assuming it’s stock tune for 70+ octane where we obviously run 100LL; so advancing by the timing seems the way to go.

Can I safely turn up the max revs in your opinion? 2550 on 6A should easily yield a good 300hp but at what cost?

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jay-dub



Joined: 31 May 2014
Posts: 91
Location: UK

PostPosted: Mon Jun 24, 2019 1:12 pm    Post subject: Re: HS-6 engine needed Reply with quote

At 68/2050, 58 lph (15.3 USgph) properly leaned to the throttle. At 70/2100, 67 lph (17.7 US gph), assuming the fuel flow computer is correct.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 24, 2019 1:34 pm    Post subject: HS-6 engine needed Reply with quote

I think your over feeding it!!  Ideally you should be burning 13.5 to 14.5 GPH at cruise.  That may go a long way to solve your cool engine problem.  
Have you ever checked to see what jets you have in your carb?
Check page 44 of the Maint and Service Instructions for Aero Engine HOUSAI -6A
Doug
On Mon, Jun 24, 2019 at 2:23 PM jay-dub <flyjnw(at)gmail.com (flyjnw(at)gmail.com)> wrote:

Quote:
--> Yak-List message posted by: "jay-dub" <flyjnw(at)gmail.com (flyjnw(at)gmail.com)>

At 68/2050, 58 lph (15.3 USgph) properly leaned. At 70/2100, 67 lph (17.7 US gph), assuming the fuel flow computer is correct.

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jay-dub



Joined: 31 May 2014
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 24, 2019 10:12 pm    Post subject: Re: HS-6 engine needed Reply with quote

I’ll have my guys take a look.

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2019 3:16 am    Post subject: HS-6 engine needed Reply with quote

All I can say is that, to the best of my knowledge, all that the Russians did to go from the AI 14 RA (the first series built-in large quantities, with 260 hp) to the AI 14 RF of 300 hp was increasing the rpm.

I would be reasonably confident that the same could be done with the HS-6 engine, particularly because there are also, significantly more powerful versions of the same engine which would suggest that the basic engine is reasonably strong.

But you should also consider that higher speeds might cause aerodynamic inefficiencies in the propeller – I simply don't know the gearing on the Chinese engine.

Richard
RICHARD GOODE AEROBATICS
Rhodds Farm, Lyonshall, Hereford, HR5 3LW, UK
Tel: +44 (0)1544 340120 Fax: +44 (0)1544 340129
e-mail: richard.goode(at)russianaeros.com
www.russianaeros.com
WORLD LEADERS IN RUSSIAN SPORTING AIRCRAFT & ENGINES
In partnership with Aerometal Kft, Hungary.

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jay-dub



Joined: 31 May 2014
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2019 4:04 am    Post subject: Re: HS-6 engine needed Reply with quote

HS6 & 6A is 0.787 versus 0.658 for the M14P - presumably as a result of the greater engine RPM in the latter.

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2019 4:48 am    Post subject: HS-6 engine needed Reply with quote

So the propeller speed at 2550 rpm with the HS-6 would be equivalent to just
over 3000 rpm with the M 14. Apart from any other issues, I don't think
there would be any consideration of propeller inefficiency at those speeds.
RICHARD GOODE AEROBATICS
Rhodds Farm, Lyonshall, Hereford, HR5 3LW, UK
Tel: +44 (0)1544 340120 Fax: +44 (0)1544 340129
e-mail: richard.goode(at)russianaeros.com
www.russianaeros.com
WORLD LEADERS IN RUSSIAN SPORTING AIRCRAFT & ENGINES
In partnership with Aerometal Kft, Hungary.
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