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switches?

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CJohnston(at)popsound.com
Guest

Posted: Wed Dec 20, 2006 3:11 pm Post subject: switches?

Hey all - 



I'm trying to nail down some ancillary components for the panel, and

have a couple of questions.  For those of you who have installed a

trutrak ap, how many poles and throws are required of the switch that

switches the AP source from a NAV radio to the GPS (chelton)?  I

couldn't find a reference to it in the Trutrak installation

instructions. Also, I plan to have a switch that will move all functions

except PTT from the pilot to co-pilot side.  Are people using relays to

accomplish this?  if so, I suspect a SPST or SPDT switch would fit the

bill?  I'm away from all my reference materials, and I'm trying to nail

down what I need to order.



Thanks all!

cj

#40410

fuse

www.perfectlygoodairplane.net



do not archive

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rene(at)felker.com
Guest

Posted: Wed Dec 20, 2006 3:31 pm Post subject: switches?

For the stick switches, I am using one switch and putting all the grounds

through it.  Not my original idea, but sounded like a good way to go.  I

will let you know if it works once I get my panel finished. 



Rene' Felker

40322

N423CF

Finish kit or something like it.

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noel(at)blueskyaviation.n
Guest

Posted: Wed Dec 20, 2006 4:22 pm Post subject: switches?

CJ



Double through double pole.  Auto pilot arinc a & b in the middle gps arinc

a & b on one end and effis aric a & b on the other.  



I have installed 4 or five Grand rapids EFIS now with the trutrak autopilot

and the next two that are currently in the works I am NOT putting the arinc

source switch in.  Just going directly to the EFIS.  Why?  When you switch

arinc sources the autopilot drops out of GPSS (well after a few seconds) at

witch time your scan is somewhere else on the panel, then the plane starts

doing something else than what you have in mind.  So you get the autopilot

back up on GPSS and it reacquires the GPS track so heading changes are in

order.  After a few times like this you get really good and switch the Arinc

source turn the autopilot to heading mode and then back to GPSS and life is

great.  OR you can just leave the autopilot alone and use the EFIS the

autopilot never drops off line and life is great.



my 2.3333333 cents worth

Noel 

The rest of the story:



To isolate pilot and copilot we just put an (ON NONE ON) switch that

controls the grounding for the switches located on the two sticks, you will

want to keep the PTT on both sticks alive no mater what stick the isolate

switch is favoring.



The rest of my 2.6666666666 cents worth



Noel



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stein(at)steinair.com
Guest

Posted: Wed Dec 20, 2006 4:49 pm Post subject: switches?

Hi Chris,



If you're using anything other than an RV-10 Autopilot or Sorcerer you can't

switch between a NAV & GPS....only RS-232 and/or ARINC signals (of course

there is always an exception, this time being the 480).  You can switch

between two devices RS-232 GPS signals and/or two devices which give RS-232

& ARINC, but typically the autopilot source select switch that you see on

most Chelton panels is for the GPS feed only.  The NAV side requires the

higher end AP's and then it would require a multiple pole relay due to the

large number of wires needed.  If it's GPS & ARINC only it's only 1 or 3

wires....



I hope I helped a little, I know - clear as mud right?!?!  Give me a call of

list and we'll get it figured out for you.  Stick functions depend totally

on the number of items being switched, but if it's many of them then a relay

is a must.



Cheers,

Stein.



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Tim(at)MyRV10.com
Guest

Posted: Wed Dec 20, 2006 5:56 pm Post subject: switches?

You've got some good answers already Chris, but I'll try to explain

mine, and in a different way.



You can either do a double-pole double-throw, or you can get a quad-pole

switch.  There are 2 ARINC lines, and 1 serial lines that are in

question.  The serial line just gets the GPS position data from

the GPS, so the Autopilot knows it's TRK.  If you don't provide

GPS, it would only know heading.  The ARINC does the controlling

of the autopilot.  So now it gets fun...    You can leave your

Serial switch on one GPS all the time if you wish, if you have a

GPS you can count on.  Your ARINC you may want to switch between

an EFIS or a NAV/COM/GPS unit.   I have my Cheltons or my GNS480

drive my autopilot.



Now, on the panel is a source select switch for those 2 systems.

That one just switches the ARINC lines, in my case.  So I can

control the system from either source.   My GPS signal I have

on an under-panel hidden switch, that can select between my

Chelton GPS, or the GNS-480.  This switch I usually leave on

the GNS-480 side, because that's my WAAS GPS that supposedly

would be top notch.   However, I did put the switch there,

because if I need to run at minimum power draw, my GNS-480

is getting the boot and it shuts off with the master, when I'm

running E-bus only.   So therefore, I wanted a switch behind the

panel that I could move to the other side for GPS source.  It's

just on a little L bracket on the panel so it's easy to feel for

and find.



Now for the stick stuff.  I really like the way I did it, and

here's how and why.



On my panel I have a switch labeled like

TRIM CONTROL - Pilot / Co-Pilot

The labeling isn't what I'd want, and you'll see why.



My PILOT side stick is always active, for everything. I didn't

want ANY switch to knock me out of control.  I will not let

most anyone fly my plane from the Left seat.   My CO-Pilot stick,

however, has the switches for Trims, Frequency flip-flops, and

anything else that I deemed something that the kids or another

person could bump or mess with, as "restricted" devices.  When

the switch is in the PILOT position (should read PILOT ONLY), then

those items have their grounds cut off....so the switches don't

function.   When it's in the Co-Pilot position (Should read

PILOT/CO-PILOT), then those grounds are available and the functions

will work.  This allows me to basically deactivate that stick

for all but a couple things, like PTT, unless I want it activated.

When I fly with the wife, it's usually activated.  When the kids

come up, it's rarely activated.   It works very well and

should help keep people from bumping things they shouldn't.



Note that since it's just one ground, the switch can be a SPST

if you wish.  There isn't a center position.

Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying



Chris Johnston wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   

 

 Hey all - 

 

 I'm trying to nail down some ancillary components for the panel, and

 have a couple of questions.  For those of you who have installed a

 trutrak ap, how many poles and throws are required of the switch that

 switches the AP source from a NAV radio to the GPS (chelton)?  I

 couldn't find a reference to it in the Trutrak installation

 instructions. Also, I plan to have a switch that will move all functions

 except PTT from the pilot to co-pilot side.  Are people using relays to

 accomplish this?  if so, I suspect a SPST or SPDT switch would fit the

 bill?  I'm away from all my reference materials, and I'm trying to nail

 down what I need to order.

 

 Thanks all!

 cj

 #40410

 fuse

 www.perfectlygoodairplane.net

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Tim(at)MyRV10.com
Guest

Posted: Wed Dec 20, 2006 5:59 pm Post subject: switches?

I forgot to add in my post I just did for this reply that on the

Autopilot source, you could switch your stuff with a quad switch,

and flip both the ARINC and Serial lines from source to source, and

that would work fine too.  That would be the simplest way to

do it, but it would have to re-acquire itself when it loses the

GPS signal to the AP, so it would take a couple more seconds for it

to re-learn it's TRK.



Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying

do not archive

Chris Johnston wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   

 

 Hey all - 

 

 I'm trying to nail down some ancillary components for the panel, and

 have a couple of questions.  For those of you who have installed a

 trutrak ap, how many poles and throws are required of the switch that

 switches the AP source from a NAV radio to the GPS (chelton)?  I

 couldn't find a reference to it in the Trutrak installation

 instructions. Also, I plan to have a switch that will move all functions

 except PTT from the pilot to co-pilot side.  Are people using relays to

 accomplish this?  if so, I suspect a SPST or SPDT switch would fit the

 bill?  I'm away from all my reference materials, and I'm trying to nail

 down what I need to order.

 

 Thanks all!

 cj

 #40410

 fuse

 www.perfectlygoodairplane.net

 

 do not archive

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Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:

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jesse(at)itecusa.org
Guest

Posted: Wed Dec 20, 2006 8:00 pm Post subject: switches?

Am I wrong in thinking that the ARINC is just for adding the GPSS feature,

but with just the serial connection you can still have the GPS control the

autopilot, but it will not "cut the corner" in a turn at a waypoint?  I

think I remember this being the case.  In this case you don't truly NEED

ARINC at all, but it makes it better.



In answer to your question as asked, the NAV radio and the GPS do completely

different things in the AP, so you don't need a switch at all.  The NAV

radio would control the AP when flying on a VOR, LOC or ILS and the GPS

would control it when flying, well, GPS.  As Stein said, this would only

apply to the RV-10 AP or the Sorcerer, since none of the others have the NAV

function.  If you are referring to two actual GPS sources, then the other

replies will do the trick.  For the Sorcerer, the NAV side connects to GS

Up, GS Down, Nav Left, Nav Right, and LOC trigger wires from the Nav radio.

On the GPS, you have the RS-232 wire and two ARINC's if you are using that

function (which I very much do recommend, in case my post leads you to

believe that it isn't beneficial).



On the trims, contrary to what may be normal these days in "Experimentals",

I wired all controls on both sticks active always.  No switch.  The only

problem may come when the copilot bumps the non-momentary flap up switch and

leaves it up and then the pilot tries to lower the flaps and they don't go

down.  To remedy this I just put in a momentary up as well as momentary down

on the copilot's flap switch.  Nothing has blown up yet, but it might at any

time.



Do not archive.



Jesse Saint

I-TEC, Inc.

jesse(at)itecusa.org

www.itecusa.org

Cell: 352-427-0285

Fax: 815-377-3694



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