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Rule breakers Was: Re: This feud isn't pretty!

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Guy Buchanan

Joined: 16 Jul 2006
Posts: 1204
Location: Ramona, CA

Posted: Sat Jan 05, 2008 10:06 am Post subject: Rule breakers Was: Re: This feud isn't pretty!

At 07:13 AM 1/5/2008, you wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  5 days later I get a letter from the airport manager stating that 

there were multiple complaints about me doing erratic flying at 

their airport and if it continues they will turn me into the 

FSDO.  I did nothing wrong, but somebody on the ground didn't like 

my flying and got with his friends and they complained to the airport manager.


	


Mike,

         Thank you, you have made my point. Whatever you were doing 

scared the groundlings enough to complain. Yes, there are the 

occasional nut-cases sitting at the ends of runways, but they are 

usually notorious and are ignored by airport managers and the local 

FAA. Yet you said you were doing something new and that there were 

multiple complaints. And interestingly enough these complaints were 

sufficient to make the airport manager threaten you, either because 

of their nature, or because the status of who made them. As a result 

you have jeopardized that airport's future, and put yet another nail 

in the coffin of general aviation. What happened? Let's address the 

possibilities:



1. You were doing something illegal and unsafe. Is any discussion necessary?



2. You were doing something legal and unsafe. Discussion?



3. You were doing something illegal and safe. The rules we fly by are 

designed, in large part, to keep everyone safe. You and I both know 

it is possible to fly outside the rules and be perfectly safe. What's 

the point? Some of the rules are designed to give the groundlings a 

perception of safety, to keep us out of the public eye. You and I 

both know we can fly within 50' of anything and anybody in perfect 

safety, yet it scares the crap out of the un-informed when we do it. 

Thus the rule that says stay 500' away from anything that might 

contain a human. (My paraphrase.) There are others. (Do we really 

need 1000' AGL pattern altitudes? What's wrong with flying under 

bridges? Why can't we land on public property in CA where there are 

huge dry lake beds? Why can't we land on roads?)



4. You were doing something legal and safe. If this is the case you 

should seriously consider a small educational effort wherein you get 

together with the complainants and explain what you were doing and 

why, why it was legal, and more importantly, why it was safe. (Maybe 

the airport manager should attend, too.) You will then have removed 

your's and maybe a few other's nails from the GA coffin. Yes I know 

it's an effort, but after all, it's your nail.

Guy Buchanan

San Diego, CA

K-IV 1200 / 582-C / Warp / 100% done, thanks mostly to Bob Ducar.

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_________________
Guy Buchanan
Deceased K-IV 1200
A glider pilot too.

kitfoxmike

Joined: 05 Dec 2006
Posts: 373

Posted: Sun Jan 06, 2008 1:04 pm Post subject: Re: Rule breakers Was: Re: This feud isn't pretty!

 	  Guy Buchanan wrote: 	
		  At 07:13 AM 1/5/2008, you wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  5 days later I get a letter from the airport manager stating that 

there were multiple complaints about me doing erratic flying at 

their airport and if it continues they will turn me into the 

FSDO.  I did nothing wrong, but somebody on the ground didn't like 

my flying and got with his friends and they complained to the airport manager.



	


Mike,

         Thank you, you have made my point. Whatever you were doing 

scared the groundlings enough to complain. Yes, there are the 

occasional nut-cases sitting at the ends of runways, but they are 

usually notorious and are ignored by airport managers and the local 

FAA. Yet you said you were doing something new and that there were 

multiple complaints. And interestingly enough these complaints were 

sufficient to make the airport manager threaten you, either because 

of their nature, or because the status of who made them. As a result 

you have jeopardized that airport's future, and put yet another nail 

in the coffin of general aviation. What happened? Let's address the 

possibilities:



1. You were doing something illegal and unsafe. Is any discussion necessary?



2. You were doing something legal and unsafe. Discussion?



3. You were doing something illegal and safe. The rules we fly by are 

designed, in large part, to keep everyone safe. You and I both know 

it is possible to fly outside the rules and be perfectly safe. What's 

the point? Some of the rules are designed to give the groundlings a 

perception of safety, to keep us out of the public eye. You and I 

both know we can fly within 50' of anything and anybody in perfect 

safety, yet it scares the crap out of the un-informed when we do it. 

Thus the rule that says stay 500' away from anything that might 

contain a human. (My paraphrase.) There are others. (Do we really 

need 1000' AGL pattern altitudes? What's wrong with flying under 

bridges? Why can't we land on public property in CA where there are 

huge dry lake beds? Why can't we land on roads?)



4. You were doing something legal and safe. If this is the case you 

should seriously consider a small educational effort wherein you get 

together with the complainants and explain what you were doing and 

why, why it was legal, and more importantly, why it was safe. (Maybe 

the airport manager should attend, too.) You will then have removed 

your's and maybe a few other's nails from the GA coffin. Yes I know 

it's an effort, but after all, it's your nail.

Guy Buchanan

San Diego, CA

K-IV 1200 / 582-C / Warp / 100% done, thanks mostly to Bob Ducar. 	




I didn't prove any of your points.



I must have done something unsafe.  BS



I didn't do anything wrong, all I did was do touch and go's on all runways.



I asked another pilot about this and he immediately said, Oh you did touch and go's on all runways, that's enough to piss people off at that airport.



I guess the point I'm trying to get out here is the fact that there are so called pilots out there that want to see the classic flying of student pilots.  

BY THE BOOK.



All I can say is let people go around turning pilots in, it will keep the airwaves free, more spacing for me.  I have a terrible time with pilots that are not proficient.  They constantly turn in front of me on final, turn into my flight path on take off(parallel runways), pop out on the runway at the hold short lines when I'm on final.  If it will discourage pilots from flying, (fear of being turned into the FAA).  THen great, it will keep those idiots out  of the sky.

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Guy Buchanan

Joined: 16 Jul 2006
Posts: 1204
Location: Ramona, CA

Posted: Sun Jan 06, 2008 2:16 pm Post subject: Rule breakers Was: Re: This feud isn't pretty!

At 01:04 PM 1/6/2008, you wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  I guess the point I'm trying to get out here is the fact that there 

are so called pilots out there that want to see the classic flying 

of student pilots.

BY THE BOOK.


	


Mike,

         What did you do that might not have been "BY THE BOOK". 

Certainly not doing touch and goes on all runways; that's what 

they're for. I think you're saying that what you did was both legal 

and safe. If so, why don't you work with the airport manager to 

explain that to the complainers? Then you'll be free to continue with 

that activity.

Guy Buchanan

San Diego, CA

K-IV 1200 / 582-C / Warp / 100% done, thanks mostly to Bob Ducar.

- The Matronics Kitfox-List Email Forum -

Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:

http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List

_________________
Guy Buchanan
Deceased K-IV 1200
A glider pilot too.

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