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jimh474(at)embarqmail.com
Guest

Posted: Fri Apr 18, 2008 3:27 pm Post subject: expert in everything

Ron;



I don't interact very often on the Kolb list, just read and chuckle.



Ron, It seems that you give a bunch of advice in areas that you have no

experience, or you fail to state your experience in certain subjects, i.e. 

parachutes.



As to parachutes, what is your experience factor on this subject? Are you

getting a rebate from BRS so you promote their product?



There is more than one solution to a recovery parachutes than BRS.



There is nothing wrong with a hand deployed parachute. It eliminates the 

malfunction of a mortar. If the individual

using that item rehearses how he is going to deploy it. That is the 

paramount item in a hand deployed parachute. Same with a BRS or any other 

recovery

parachute. How many on this list has every went through emergency procedures

of when and how they will deploy a parachute. I will bet you that most have 

never considered rehearsing the procedure. Just take for granted that piece 

of nylon will save their butt.



Hand deployed or mortar deployed, the individual has to know when to deploy 

and how. It should be second nature to grab the deployment handle without 

even looking.  I also bet you if some of the folks on this list was sitting 

in their airplane and you told them to deploy their recovery parachute, they 

would have to sit there and think a few seconds of where the hell the handle 

is, Seconds wasted is altitude. I think that a person should rehearse this 

until it is second nature to them.



For a mortar actuated recovery parachute, the activating handle should be in 

easy reach, in case G loads from a catastrophic failure should incur they 

could overcome the G forces generated by the failure.



Hand deployed, is simple, it is either attached to your chest or in a very 

close proximity to the pilot. On hand deployed I would suggest throwing the

deployment bag down and out from the airplane. This will keep it away from

most areas where it could get entangled. Also, you have more force in

strength throwing it down and away.( This method saved my brothers butt on

two occasions) Yes, I packed both of them.



Unlike silk prior to WWII which was sensitive to the environment and had to 

be handled with kid gloves, thanks to DuPont that created a nylon fabric for

parachutes that is almost indestructible. Very few things will cause nylon 

to go south, acid, direct sunlight. Age is really not a factor on a 

parachute made of nylon that has been properly cared for. The biggest thing 

I see with recovery parachutes is the bridle, if it is a synthetic material

exposed to the sun, that is always an iffy question of whether or not it

will hold the load on deployment. Ultra violet rays works on all man made 

synthetic materials and it is undetectable by eye ball whether the item has 

deteriorated or not. I would suggest using a wire cable.



Experience with parachutes, I have a wee bit. I jumped out of airplanes for 

over 20 years, certified military parachute rigger,was involved with

development of several parachute systems and many other air item systems. I 

have over 2000 parachute jumps ranging from 500 feet to 43,500 feet. ( that 

is higher than most of you have ever flown commercial).



Don't get me wrong I am not blowing my horn, just hope that I can give a

hint to the folks on this list that a parachute whether hand deployed or 

mortar, regardless of how it is deployed and used properly will save your

bacon. But, you have to be the one to be able to deploy it properly. That 

comes from practicing how to properly deploy it.



Of course, Murphy may have something to say about!



Jim Hauck



The Older better looking  Brother To John H

pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com
Guest

Posted: Sat Apr 19, 2008 2:17 am Post subject: expert in everything

Of course, Murphy may have something to say about!>>



Hi John,



have you seen the clip on Youtube of the chute deploying just as a 

weightshift leaves the ground?  Enough to make you wonder.



Chutes are almost non existant over here. I used to have one on my old 

Thruster but didn`t continue when I swithched to the Challenger. I don`t 

think I have ever seen one fitted in the UK. On the other hand I believe 

that they are mandatory in Germany.



Cheers



Pat

lucien

Joined: 03 Jun 2007
Posts: 721
Location: santa fe, NM

Posted: Sat Apr 19, 2008 8:48 am Post subject: Re: expert in everything

 	  pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com wrote: 	
		  Of course, Murphy may have something to say about!>>



Hi John,



have you seen the clip on Youtube of the chute deploying just as a 

weightshift leaves the ground?  Enough to make you wonder.



Chutes are almost non existant over here. I used to have one on my old 

Thruster but didn`t continue when I swithched to the Challenger. I don`t 

think I have ever seen one fitted in the UK. On the other hand I believe 

that they are mandatory in Germany.



Cheers



Pat 	




My .02 on the chute,



The biggest con of the chute is what the original poster alluded to - actual deployment and descent to the ground can't be actually practiced in the air.



The lifeblood of emergency procedures is actual practice of them in the air in the airplane. Engine-outs, unusual attitudes and so forth; all of these we can go up in the airplane and practice under actual conditions.



Emergency procedures that can't be practiced or even simulated to any degree aren't worth very much - as we know in an actual emergency training takes priority over thinking the situation through.



So I personally don't see a large value to fitting the ballistic chutes to our planes, particularly to good designs like the ones we fly. There is a remote possibility that the chute could save your life in a very extreme circumstance, but because of the very small likelihood of encountering such a situation, I personally don't think it's worth 3000 bucks.



3000 bucks will buy lots of maintenance items, as well as gas for practicing flying the plane in more "simulatable" emergency scenarios like engine-outs and such.



Again, JMHO,



LS

_________________
LS
Titan II SS

Steve Boetto

Joined: 11 Jan 2006
Posts: 365

Posted: Sat Apr 19, 2008 11:18 am Post subject: expert in everything

Nice thought, certianly something to think about as you watch the houses on  the ground get bigger.  But seriously, you are forgetting the rest of the  formula.  I fly sans windshield. If I take a bird in the face the plane may  be perfectly functional but I might be flying blind.  No way to land that  sucker. There are other situations when a chute would help of which an engine  out is not on my list. There was an excrllent article a few years ago in Sport  Pilot.

  

  

 Steve    

 FF #007/floats

 FF #040/floats SnF 2008 UL Grand Champ

  

  In a message dated 4/19/2008 12:52:04 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,  lstavenhagen(at)hotmail.com writes:

  	  Quote: 	
		  

So I    personally don't see a large value to fitting the ballistic chutes to our    planes, particularly to good designs like the ones we fly. There is a remote    possibility that the chute could save your life in a very extreme    circumstance, but because of the very small likelihood of encountering such a    situation, I personally don't think it's worth 3000 bucks.



3000 bucks    will buy lots of maintenance items, as well as gas for practicing flying the    plane in more "simulatable" emergency scenarios like engine-outs and    such.



Again,  JMHO,



LS

	




Need a new ride? Check out the largest site for U.S. used car listings at AOL Autos.

  [quote][b]

John Hauck

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)

Posted: Sat Apr 19, 2008 12:58 pm Post subject: expert in everything

> My .02 on the chute,

 	  Quote: 	
		  

 The biggest con of the chute is what the original poster alluded to - 

 actual deployment and descent to the ground can't be actually practiced in 

 the air.



 The lifeblood of emergency procedures is actual practice of them in the 

 air in the airplane. Engine-outs, unusual attitudes and so forth; all of 

 these we can go up in the airplane and practice under actual conditions.



 Emergency procedures that can't be practiced or even simulated to any 

 degree aren't worth very much - as we know in an actual emergency training 

 takes priority over thinking the situation through.



 So I personally don't see a large value to fitting the ballistic chutes to 

 our planes, particularly to good designs like the ones we fly. There is a 

 remote possibility that the chute could save your life in a very extreme 

 circumstance, but because of the very small likelihood of encountering 

 such a situation, I personally don't think it's worth 3000 bucks.



 3000 bucks will buy lots of maintenance items, as well as gas for 

 practicing flying the plane in more "simulatable" emergency scenarios like 

 engine-outs and such.



 Again, JMHO,



 LS


	


Lucien:



Anyone that can fly a Kolb can land it in an emergency situation without 

power.  Of course, parachutes are not for that type emergency.



My first save was a catastrophic failure of the upper aileron bell crank in 

my US, October 1985.  Before the use of my parachute for the first time, my 

attitude was much the same as yours.  I can handle the situation, plus this 

is a factory welded kit and it has never happened before.  Guess I was a 

little wrong in that respect, but right in having another way to save my 

life.  Kolbs do not fly long without aileron control.



Second catastrophic failure was even more of a surprise than the first. 

Failure of leading edges of both wings on my FS 4.5 years later.  Sure, I 

flew aerobatics in the FS, as well as the US.  However, all within the 

authorized stress envelope of the aircraft.  The wing was the last thing we 

ever thought would fail.  Without the same old Handbury parachute, my flying 

career would have been permanently ended March 1990.



We don't need to actually practice parachute deployment in the air to 

receive valuable familiarization and training.  It can be done in the 

cockpit of the airplane.  Know how to grab and pull the handle with your 

eyes closed without thinking about it.  When the time comes to use it, do 

not hesitate. Time is altitude. Altitude is safety.  No matter what 

altitude, use it if you are no longer in control of the aircraft.



To think there is not a catastrophic failure in the future of your Kolb or 

any other aircraft is pretty naive.



Even though the odds of ever using a parachute in a catastrophic event are 

pretty damn slim, when the time comes to use one and you felt it was too 

expensive to purchase, and you don't have one, will probably really piss you 

off.  Don't worry about screaming all the way to the ground, you'll be so 

damn scared no sounds will be emitted.  If you are like me, you are 

thinking, "I don't believe this is happening to me."  and "Damn, I don't 

believe this is happening to me again."



I have hauled an expensive piece of equipment with me for nearly 3,000 

hours, and have not needed it.



If that 10 cent 3/16 bolt on the bottom flying wires breaks, or the nut 

comes off, I have a way to offset the problem.



Take care,



john h

mkIII



PS:  No matter how reliable your aircraft, a midair will ruin your day, with 

or without a parachute.  Could possibly save your life though.

_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama

Thom Riddle

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1597
Location: Buffalo, NY, USA (9G0)

Posted: Sat Apr 19, 2008 1:07 pm Post subject: Re: expert in everything

A good alternative to mortar powered chutes are the ones made and sold by these folks in BC, Canada.



http://www.ultralight.ca/recovery/default1.htm



They have a lot of good accessory products and at one time also made the GSC System wooden props. I understand they sold the prop business to one of their ex-employees who now runs it. I had their mechanically actuated in-flight adjustable prop on my Tornado. Very good prop in my experience.

_________________
Thom Riddle
Buffalo, NY (9G0)

Don't worry about old age... it doesn't last very long.
- Anonymous

Arty Trost

Joined: 25 May 2006
Posts: 206
Location: Sandy, Oregon

Posted: Sat Apr 19, 2008 3:01 pm Post subject: expert in everything

Lucien, I disagree with your statement  "Emergency

procedures that can't be practiced or even simulated

to any degree aren't worth very much."  (In relation

to the value of a parachute.)



A friend of mine had structural failure on his Tierra

ultralight when flying (at) 1500' AGL and pulled the

handle of his BRS chute.  He had never "practiced" -

but he had no trouble in getting the parachute to

launch.  Came down on the tail with no injury to

himself - just scared to death.  It made me a believer

in emergency chutes.  Just another form of insurance,

which I hope I'll never have to use.



Since I'm pretty small - I have only 15 lbs. over the

much-written about 90 lb. weakling! - I've often

wondered if I'd have the strength to pull the handle

and launch the chute on my Drifter.  But it's way too

expensive for me to try it out, and friends have

assured me that the adrenalin rush will give me the

strength of 10 when it comes to pulling that handle!



Arty Trost

Maxair Drifter

Sandy, Oregon



 	  Quote: 	
		    > My .02 on the chute,

 >

 > The biggest con of the chute is what the original

 poster alluded to - 

 > actual deployment and descent to the ground can't

 be actually practiced in 

 > the air.

 >

 > The lifeblood of emergency procedures is actual

 practice of them in the 

 > air in the airplane. Engine-outs, unusual

 attitudes and so forth; all of 

 > these we can go up in the airplane and practice

 under actual conditions.

 >

 > Emergency procedures that can't be practiced or

 even simulated to any 

 > degree aren't worth very much - as we know in an

 actual emergency training 

 > takes priority over thinking the situation

 through.

 >

 > So I personally don't see a large value to fitting

 the ballistic chutes to 

 > our planes, particularly to good designs like the

 ones we fly. There is a 

 > remote possibility that the chute could save your

 life in a very extreme 

 > circumstance, but because of the very small

 likelihood of encountering 

 > such a situation, I personally don't think it's

 worth 3000 bucks.

 >

 > 3000 bucks will buy lots of maintenance items, as

 well as gas for 

 > practicing flying the plane in more "simulatable"

 emergency scenarios like 

 > engine-outs and such.

 >

 > Again, JMHO,

 >

 > LS

 

 Lucien:

 

 Anyone that can fly a Kolb can land it in an

 emergency situation without 

 power.  Of course, parachutes are not for that type

 emergency.

 

 My first save was a catastrophic failure of the

 upper aileron bell crank in 

 my US, October 1985.  Before the use of my parachute

 for the first time, my 

 attitude was much the same as yours.  I can handle

 the situation, plus this 

 is a factory welded kit and it has never happened

 before.  Guess I was a 

 little wrong in that respect, but right in having

 another way to save my 

 life.  Kolbs do not fly long without aileron

 control.

 

 Second catastrophic failure was even more of a

 surprise than the first. 

 Failure of leading edges of both wings on my FS 4.5

 years later.  Sure, I 

 flew aerobatics in the FS, as well as the US. 

 However, all within the 

 authorized stress envelope of the aircraft.  The

 wing was the last thing we 

 ever thought would fail.  Without the same old

 Handbury parachute, my flying 

 career would have been permanently ended March 1990.

 

 We don't need to actually practice parachute

 deployment in the air to 

 receive valuable familiarization and training.  It

 can be done in the 

 cockpit of the airplane.  Know how to grab and pull

 the handle with your 

 eyes closed without thinking about it.  When the

 time comes to use it, do 

 not hesitate. Time is altitude. Altitude is safety. 

 No matter what 

 altitude, use it if you are no longer in control of

 the aircraft.

 

 To think there is not a catastrophic failure in the

 future of your Kolb or 

 any other aircraft is pretty naive.

 

 Even though the odds of ever using a parachute in a

 catastrophic event are 

 pretty damn slim, when the time comes to use one and

 you felt it was too 

 expensive to purchase, and you don't have one, will

 probably really piss you 

 off.  Don't worry about screaming all the way to the

 ground, you'll be so 

 damn scared no sounds will be emitted.  If you are

 like me, you are 

 thinking, "I don't believe this is happening to me."

  and "Damn, I don't 

 believe this is happening to me again."

 

 I have hauled an expensive piece of equipment with

 me for nearly 3,000 

 hours, and have not needed it.

 

 If that 10 cent 3/16 bolt on the bottom flying wires

 breaks, or the nut 

 comes off, I have a way to offset the problem.

 

 Take care,

 

 john h

 mkIII

 

 PS:  No matter how reliable your aircraft, a midair

 will ruin your day, with 

 or without a parachute.  Could possibly save your

 life though. 

 

 



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www.LessonsFromTheEdge.com



"Life's a daring adventure or nothing"

                      Helen Keller



"I refuse to tip toe through life just to arrive safely at death."

russ(at)rkiphoto.com
Guest

Posted: Sat Apr 19, 2008 4:32 pm Post subject: expert in everything

LUCIEN

DON'T KNOW ABOUT YOU BUT MY  LIFE IS WORTH A LOT  MORE THAN  A MEASLY  

3000 BUCKS.

IF I CAN  HAVE A RESCUE CHUTE ON ANYTHING I FLY, I'LL BLOODY WELL  

HAVE IT. COUNT ON IT

I'M DETERMINED TO LIVE AS LONG  AS I CAN.

YOU DO WHATEVER YOU WANT

do not archive



On Apr 19, 2008, at 12:48 PM, lucien wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   

 pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com wrote:

> Of course, Murphy may have something to say about!>>

>

> Hi John,

>

> have you seen the clip on Youtube of the chute deploying just as a

> weightshift leaves the ground?  Enough to make you wonder.

>

> Chutes are almost non existant over here. I used to have one on my  

> old

> Thruster but didn`t continue when I swithched to the Challenger. I  

> don`t

> think I have ever seen one fitted in the UK. On the other hand I  

> believe

> that they are mandatory in Germany.

>

> Cheers

>

> Pat

 My .02 on the chute,



 The biggest con of the chute is what the original poster alluded to  

 - actual deployment and descent to the ground can't be actually  

 practiced in the air.



 The lifeblood of emergency procedures is actual practice of them in  

 the air in the airplane. Engine-outs, unusual attitudes and so  

 forth; all of these we can go up in the airplane and practice under  

 actual conditions.



 Emergency procedures that can't be practiced or even simulated to  

 any degree aren't worth very much - as we know in an actual  

 emergency training takes priority over thinking the situation through.



 So I personally don't see a large value to fitting the ballistic  

 chutes to our planes, particularly to good designs like the ones we  

 fly. There is a remote possibility that the chute could save your  

 life in a very extreme circumstance, but because of the very small  

 likelihood of encountering such a situation, I personally don't  

 think it's worth 3000 bucks.



 3000 bucks will buy lots of maintenance items, as well as gas for  

 practicing flying the plane in more "simulatable" emergency  

 scenarios like engine-outs and such.



 Again, JMHO,



 LS



 --------

 LS

 FS II





 Read this topic online here:



 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=177854#177854

JetPilot

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1246

Posted: Sat Apr 19, 2008 6:38 pm Post subject: Re: expert in everything

Lucien,



You beliefs about parachutes and emergencies are very misguided.  Emergency procedure like engine out landings are complicated with a lot of variables and must be practiced to be done correctly.  Stall / Spin recovery also requires skill and technique that should be practiced.



Pulling a handle on a chute is not something that needs to be practiced to be done successfully.  If my airplane becomes uncontrollable for any of a million possible reasons, I will pull the handle and the chute will come out, not a lot of skill involved.   The chute is going to deploy by itself once the handle is pulled, the technique I use to pull pull that handle, how hard, or how fast I am going to pull the handle is not going to change a damn thing, the chute will come out in just the same way...

 

BRS Chutes have been a huge success in Cirrus aircraft.  There are also over 200 saves listed on:



http://www.brsparachutes.com/files/Documents/Lives-Saved.pdf



If someone is unable to grasp the concept of pulling a big red handle just because there is no way to practice it, they should probably not be flying.



Mike

_________________
"NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have !!!

Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S

lucien

Joined: 03 Jun 2007
Posts: 721
Location: santa fe, NM

Posted: Sat Apr 19, 2008 9:23 pm Post subject: Re: expert in everything

 	  JetPilot wrote: 	
		  Lucien,



You beliefs about parachutes and emergencies are very misguided.  



If someone is unable to grasp the concept of pulling a big red handle just because there is no way to practice it, they should probably not be flying.



Mike 	




Heh... I usually get hate mail when I mention my viewpoint on the chutes, this time followed suit nicely....



As for the ongoing discussion of the chute, I'm going to stop at this point to avoid the inevitable jousting that will surely break out. Instead, I'll refer anyone interested to the yahoo groups, such as Fly-UL, where there have been very extensive threads on the pros and cons of the ballistic chutes. Most of them eventually got out of hand and the end, but still contain lots of valuable reasoning on both sides.



LS

_________________
LS
Titan II SS

Dana

Joined: 13 Dec 2007
Posts: 1047
Location: Connecticut, USA

Posted: Sun Apr 20, 2008 5:08 am Post subject: expert in everything

At 10:38 PM 4/19/2008, JetPilot wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  

BRS Chutes have been a huge success in Cirrus aircraft.  There are also 

over 200 saves listed on:

http://www.brsparachutes.com/files/Documents/Lives-Saved.pdf


	


I don't dispute that BRS's have saved lives, but about 3/4 of the "saves" 

on that list are NOT situations where a chute should have been 

used.  "Engine failure" (except in very rare situations) is not a reason to 

use a chute, and there is NO excuse for "loss of control".  As for the 

Cirrus, the chute is standard equipment because the aircraft has no 

demonstrated spin recovery (the "book" spin recovery is "pull the 

chute").  The Cirrus is a fairly hot ship; lots of fairly low time pilots 

with too much money buy one, get into trouble, panic, and pop the chute.



As for practicing, PG and HG pilots regularly do it.  The pilot sits in his 

harness suspended from something overhead, and practices reaching for the 

chute and throwing it while an instructor swings and spins him around to 

disorient him.  If it's a "reserve repack" clinic, the pilot actually 

throws the chute, then the riggers repack them at the end of the day.



Still... that rocketless Canadian one looks interesting.  I've emailed 

asking for more info and pricing.



-Dana

--

  "Makers of oils will assure you their lubricants will last the life of 

the transmission. This may be true, but that life can be longer if you 

change the oil.

jb92563

Joined: 23 Mar 2007
Posts: 314
Location: Southern California

Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 12:13 pm Post subject: Re: expert in everything

Dana,



Let us know the price you find.



Last time I checked with them a couple years ago, it was a couple hundred or 3 less than a BRS....not much difference to make it worthwhile over a BRS.



Perhaps now that the Canadian dollar is worth more, they will cost more than a BRS, unless they lowered their prices.

_________________
Ray

Kolb UltraStar (Cuyuna UL-202)
Moni MotorGlider
Schreder HP-11 Glider
Grob 109 Motorglider

Do Not Archive

Dana

Joined: 13 Dec 2007
Posts: 1047
Location: Connecticut, USA

Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 1:34 pm Post subject: expert in everything

At 04:13 PM 4/21/2008, jb92563 wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		  Last time I checked with them a couple years ago, it was a couple hundred 

or 3 less than a BRS....not much difference to make it worthwhile over a BRS.


	


I guess not much has changed:



 	  Quote: 	
		  RPS 525 is $ 2450 plus shipping

It weighs 16 lbs

Repacking interval is every 5 years and it can be done by a rigger, does

not necessarily have to come back to us.

Delivery is 4 - 6 weeks from confirmed order date.  All orders are

confirmed by a deposit of $ 1000 before we will proceed with the order.


	


Yikes, that's only $50 less than I paid for my plane... including 

trailer!  'Fraid the budget doesn't run to it right now...



-Dana

--

  In general, liberalism consists of A & B getting together to see what 

they can make C do for poor old D.

Thom Riddle

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1597
Location: Buffalo, NY, USA (9G0)

Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 1:47 pm Post subject: Re: expert in everything

re: spring launched vs rocket launched recovery chutes



Saving $300 is worth... $300. Another payoff is that you don't have to pay HAZMAT fees when shipping. A high quality spring launch is pretty much murphy proof.



I'm not selling them and have never owned one but if it every comes time for me to replace my BRS, it will be with the spring-launched one.

_________________
Thom Riddle
Buffalo, NY (9G0)

Don't worry about old age... it doesn't last very long.
- Anonymous

John Hauck

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)

Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 2:05 pm Post subject: expert in everything

> I'm not selling them and have never owned one but if it every comes time 

for me to replace my BRS, it will be with the spring-launched one.

 	  Quote: 	
		  

 --------

 Thom Riddle


	




Thom R:



How well does the spring loaded lauch compare with the solid rocket launch 

of the BRS?



john h

mkIII

_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama

jb92563

Joined: 23 Mar 2007
Posts: 314
Location: Southern California

Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 3:29 pm Post subject: Re: expert in everything

A spring launch is in essence similar to hand toss deployment in that it will not rip through anything that gets in its way like a rocket would.



I imagine the deployment to full line stretch and opening is slower.



Any chute system has to be better than none.



I have a hand deployed and a backpack chute and am wondering which would be better....jumping, clearing, pulling or just tossing and hanging on.

    



Any one of those though is better than having a front row pew for a quick prayer and waiting for impact.

_________________
Ray

Kolb UltraStar (Cuyuna UL-202)
Moni MotorGlider
Schreder HP-11 Glider
Grob 109 Motorglider

Do Not Archive

cristalclear13

Joined: 19 Sep 2007
Posts: 363
Location: Southeast Georgia

Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 11:37 am Post subject: Re: expert in everything

Ray,

Hopefully your backpack chute instructions are better than the one in this video (check out about 3 1/2 minutes into the video) and you'll see what I mean:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tv55-m1KHAo

_________________
Cristal Waters
Kolb Mark II Twinstar Rotax 503 DCSI Sept 2007 - sold Sept 2012
Private Pilot Aug 2008
ELSA Repairman for N193Y April 2008
Rotax 2 stroke maintenance April 2009

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