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Matt Dralle
Site Admin

Joined: 08 Nov 2005
Posts: 25204
Location: Livermore CA USA

Posted: Thu May 28, 2009 12:48 pm Post subject: Mounting The Engine...

Dear Listers,



I'm getting close to mounting the engine on the 'ol RV-8.  I'd like to hold off riveting the front top skin on until I'm sure all of the wiring and what not works with the various engine sensors.  Is it "safe" to mount the engine before this skin is in place?  Also, I have a QB and I noticed that none of the rivets along the sides where the cowl hinges go are riveted save for a couple of temporary pop rivets.  Can the engine be mounted before these two areas are completely riveted?



Thanks!



Matt Dralle

RV-8 #82880 N998RV

Finishing Up The Wheels & Brakes...

_________________
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Administrator

khorton01(at)rogers.com
Guest

Posted: Thu May 28, 2009 1:17 pm Post subject: Mounting The Engine...

On Thu, May 28, 2009 at 16:46, Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com (dralle(at)matronics.com)> wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		    --> RV-List message posted by: Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com (dralle(at)matronics.com)>

 

 I'm getting close to mounting the engine on the 'ol RV-8.  I'd like to hold off riveting the front top skin on until I'm sure all of the wiring and what not works with the various engine sensors.  Is it "safe" to mount the engine before this skin is in place?  Also, I have a QB and I noticed that none of the rivets along the sides where the cowl hinges go are riveted save for a couple of temporary pop rivets.  Can the engine be mounted before these two areas are completely riveted?

   	


My engine was on the mount for years before I riveted the front top skin.  I'd do it that again.  I checked my photos, and the rivets between the side skins and the firewall flanges (the ones that hold the cowl hinges) were also done after the engine had been hung.

  

Good luck hanging the engine.



--

Kevin Horton

Ottawa, Canada

  [quote][b]

gyoung

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 211
Location: Republic of Texas

Posted: Thu May 28, 2009 1:29 pm Post subject: Mounting The Engine...

On my RV-6 I hung the engine without the top skin but I'd recommend putting

a rivet in every hole on the side skin to upper longeron. There is a lot of

stress on those skins so I would not do it without riveting the side and

bottom cowling attachments.



Regards,

Greg Young

 



[quote] --

Michael Wynn

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 148
Location: San Ramon, CA

Posted: Thu May 28, 2009 2:20 pm Post subject: Mounting The Engine...

I would echo the same thing.  It is just not a problem to mount the  engine without the front upper skin on.  There is a great little  instruction on the VAF web site on mounting the engine.  You definitely  need a friend.

  

 Regards,

  

 Michael Wynn

 RV 8 FWF

 San Ramon, CA

  

  In a message dated 5/28/2009 2:24:25 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time,  khorton01(at)rogers.com writes:

  	  Quote: 	
		  On Thu,    May 28, 2009 at 16:46, Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com (dralle(at)matronics.com)>    wrote:

       	  Quote: 	
		  -->      RV-List message posted by: Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com (dralle(at)matronics.com)>



I'm      getting close to mounting the engine on the 'ol RV-8.  I'd like to hold      off riveting the front top skin on until I'm sure all of the wiring and what      not works with the various engine sensors.  Is it "safe" to mount the      engine before this skin is in place?  Also, I have a QB and I noticed      that none of the rivets along the sides where the cowl hinges go are riveted      save for a couple of temporary pop rivets.  Can the engine be mounted      before these two areas are completely riveted?

	
   

My engine was on the mount for years before I riveted the front top    skin.  I'd do it that again.  I checked my photos, and the rivets    between the side skins and the firewall flanges (the ones that hold the cowl    hinges) were also done after the engine had been hung.



Good luck    hanging the engine.



--

Kevin Horton

Ottawa,  Canada

 	  Quote: 	
		  



====================================

="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List

====================================

ms.matronics.com/">http://forums.matronics.com

====================================

tp://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution

====================================



	
	


 We found the real 'Hotel California' and the 'Seinfeld' diner. What will you find? Explore WhereItsAt.com.

  [quote][b]

_________________
Michael Wynn
RV 8
San Ramon, CA

stan.jones(at)xtra.co.nz
Guest

Posted: Thu May 28, 2009 3:13 pm Post subject: Mounting The Engine...

Yes Matt, I am looking at the same problem. I am building a slider,  

and the front section of that can't be built until the top skin is in  

place.

I would like to start the motor to verify all of my wiring is OK.

It's going to be a bit dicey not having those rivets in place and 200  

HP thrashing around in the front

I would be interested to hear what others have done



Stan Jones

On 29/05/2009, at 8:46 AM, Matt Dralle wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   

 Dear Listers,



 I'm getting close to mounting the engine on the 'ol RV-8.  I'd like  

 to hold off riveting the front top skin on until I'm sure all of  

 the wiring and what not works with the various engine sensors.  Is  

 it "safe" to mount the engine before this skin is in place?  Also,  

 I have a QB and I noticed that none of the rivets along the sides  

 where the cowl hinges go are riveted save for a couple of temporary  

 pop rivets.  Can the engine be mounted before these two areas are  

 completely riveted?



 Thanks!



 Matt Dralle

 RV-8 #82880 N998RV

 Finishing Up The Wheels & Brakes...

Matt Dralle
Site Admin

Joined: 08 Nov 2005
Posts: 25204
Location: Livermore CA USA

Posted: Thu May 28, 2009 3:23 pm Post subject: Mounting The Engine...

Hum, hadn't though about actually starting the motor without the skin on.  I was just thinking about whether it would hold the static weight.  I guess to test all the wiring, the engine would really need to be started.  

So I guess I'll rephrase my question to "Could the engine be hung AND run without the top skin and sides riveted?"  ...?

Matt

At 04:11 PM 5/28/2009  Thursday, you wrote:

 	  Quote: 	

Yes Matt, I am looking at the same problem. I am building a slider,  

and the front section of that can't be built until the top skin is in  

place.

I would like to start the motor to verify all of my wiring is OK.

It's going to be a bit dicey not having those rivets in place and 200  

HP thrashing around in the front

I would be interested to hear what others have done

Stan Jones

On 29/05/2009, at 8:46 AM, Matt Dralle wrote:

>

>Dear Listers,

>

>I'm getting close to mounting the engine on the 'ol RV-8.  I'd like  

>to hold off riveting the front top skin on until I'm sure all of  

>the wiring and what not works with the various engine sensors.  Is  

>it "safe" to mount the engine before this skin is in place?  Also,  

>I have a QB and I noticed that none of the rivets along the sides  

>where the cowl hinges go are riveted save for a couple of temporary  

>pop rivets.  Can the engine be mounted before these two areas are  

>completely riveted?

>

>Thanks!

>

>Matt Dralle

>RV-8 #82880 N998RV

>Finishing Up The Wheels & Brakes...

_________________
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Administrator

Larry Bowen

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 802
Location: NC, USA

Posted: Thu May 28, 2009 3:38 pm Post subject: Mounting The Engine...

Hung without top skin: OK

Run without top skin: I wouldn't



IMO,

--

Larry Bowen

Larry(at)BowenAero.com

http://BowenAero.com



 On Thu, May 28, 2009 at 7:21 PM, Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com (dralle(at)matronics.com)> wrote:

[quote] --> RV-List message posted by: Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com (dralle(at)matronics.com)>

 

 Hum, hadn't though about actually starting the motor without the skin on.  I was just thinking about whether it would hold the static weight.  I guess to test all the wiring, the engine would really need to be started.

  

 So I guess I'll rephrase my question to "Could the engine be hung AND run without the top skin and sides riveted?"  ...?

 

 Matt

 

 At 04:11 PM 5/28/2009  Thursday, you wrote:

 >--> RV-List message posted by: Stan Jones <stan.jones(at)xtra.co.nz (stan.jones(at)xtra.co.nz)>

 >

 >Yes Matt, I am looking at the same problem. I am building a slider,

 >and the front section of that can't be built until the top skin is in

 >place.

 >I would like to start the motor to verify all of my wiring is OK.

 >It's going to be a bit dicey not having those rivets in place and 200

 >HP thrashing around in the front

 >I would be interested to hear what others have done

 >

 >Stan Jones

 >On 29/05/2009, at 8:46 AM, Matt Dralle wrote:

 >

 >>--> RV-List message posted by: Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com (dralle(at)matronics.com)>

 >>

 >>

 >>Dear Listers,

 >>

 >>I'm getting close to mounting the engine on the 'ol RV-8.  I'd like

 >>to hold off riveting the front top skin on until I'm sure all of

 >>the wiring and what not works with the various engine sensors.  Is

 >>it "safe" to mount the engine before this skin is in place?  Also,

 >>I have a QB and I noticed that none of the rivets along the sides

 >>where the cowl hinges go are riveted save for a couple of temporary

 >>pop rivets.  Can the engine be mounted before these two areas are

 >>completely riveted?

 >>

 >>Thanks!

 >>

 >>Matt Dralle

 >>RV-8 #82880 N998RV

 >>Finishing Up The Wheels & Brakes...

 

 

 ===========

 get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List

 ===========

 http://forums.matronics.com

 ===========

        -Matt Dralle, List Admin.

 ="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution

 ===========

 

 

 

 [b]

_________________
Larry Bowen
RV-8 SOLD,
RV-7QB in progress...

khorton01(at)rogers.com
Guest

Posted: Thu May 28, 2009 3:45 pm Post subject: Mounting The Engine...

The engine thrashes around a bit at start and shutdown, and I'd want the structure to be complete.  I wouldn't recommend starting the engine without having all the rivets in.  



You should be able to test about 99% of the wiring without starting the engine. 

  

Kevin Horton

Ottawa, Canada

 



On Thu, May 28, 2009 at 19:21, Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com (dralle(at)matronics.com)> wrote:

[quote]  --> RV-List message posted by: Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com (dralle(at)matronics.com)>

 

 Hum, hadn't though about actually starting the motor without the skin on.  I was just thinking about whether it would hold the static weight.  I guess to test all the wiring, the engine would really need to be started.

   

 So I guess I'll rephrase my question to "Could the engine be hung AND run without the top skin and sides riveted?"  ...?

 

 Matt

 

 At 04:11 PM 5/28/2009  Thursday, you wrote:

 >--> RV-List message posted by: Stan Jones <stan.jones(at)xtra.co.nz (stan.jones(at)xtra.co.nz)>

 >

 >Yes Matt, I am looking at the same problem. I am building a slider,

 >and the front section of that can't be built until the top skin is in

 >place.

 >I would like to start the motor to verify all of my wiring is OK.

 >It's going to be a bit dicey not having those rivets in place and 200

 >HP thrashing around in the front

 >I would be interested to hear what others have done

 >

 >Stan Jones

 >On 29/05/2009, at 8:46 AM, Matt Dralle wrote:

 >

 >>--> RV-List message posted by: Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com (dralle(at)matronics.com)>

 >>

 >>

 >>Dear Listers,

 >>

 >>I'm getting close to mounting the engine on the 'ol RV-8.  I'd like

 >>to hold off riveting the front top skin on until I'm sure all of

 >>the wiring and what not works with the various engine sensors.  Is

 >>it "safe" to mount the engine before this skin is in place?  Also,

 >>I have a QB and I noticed that none of the rivets along the sides

 >>where the cowl hinges go are riveted save for a couple of temporary

 >>pop rivets.  Can the engine be mounted before these two areas are

 >>completely riveted?

 >>

 >>Thanks!

 >>

 >>Matt Dralle

 >>RV-8 #82880 N998RV

 >>Finishing Up The Wheels & Brakes...

[b]

phil(at)petrasoft.net
Guest

Posted: Fri May 29, 2009 5:19 am Post subject: Mounting The Engine...

I wouldn't start the engine until you have a complete airframe, wings  

and all.  That is a lot of torque swinging around up there.  You  

should be able to test all of your wiring without running the engine.   

You can dunk temperature sensors in hot water, pressure up pressure  

sensors with air and hit thermocouples with a heat gun.  You can  

disconnect the starter wire from the starter and hook it up to a light  

to test the starter circuit.  The alternator wiring is a little tricky  

but it's simple enough that if you have the rest right then you should  

have that right too.  Besides even if you don't have it right the  

chances are that it's all forward of the firewall anyway.



Phil Birkelbach

Houston RV7 - 727WB

phil(at)petrasoft.net

http://www.myrv7.com/



On May 28, 2009, at 6:21 PM, Matt Dralle wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   



 Hum, hadn't though about actually starting the motor without the  

 skin on.  I was just thinking about whether it would hold the static  

 weight.  I guess to test all the wiring, the engine would really  

 need to be started.



 So I guess I'll rephrase my question to "Could the engine be hung  

 AND run without the top skin and sides riveted?"  ...?



 Matt



 At 04:11 PM 5/28/2009  Thursday, you wrote:

> 

>

> Yes Matt, I am looking at the same problem. I am building a slider,

> and the front section of that can't be built until the top skin is in

> place.

> I would like to start the motor to verify all of my wiring is OK.

> It's going to be a bit dicey not having those rivets in place and 200

> HP thrashing around in the front

> I would be interested to hear what others have done

>

> Stan Jones

> On 29/05/2009, at 8:46 AM, Matt Dralle wrote:

>

>> 

>>

>>

>> Dear Listers,

>>

>> I'm getting close to mounting the engine on the 'ol RV-8.  I'd like

>> to hold off riveting the front top skin on until I'm sure all of

>> the wiring and what not works with the various engine sensors.  Is

>> it "safe" to mount the engine before this skin is in place?  Also,

>> I have a QB and I noticed that none of the rivets along the sides

>> where the cowl hinges go are riveted save for a couple of temporary

>> pop rivets.  Can the engine be mounted before these two areas are

>> completely riveted?

>>

>> Thanks!

>>

>> Matt Dralle

>> RV-8 #82880 N998RV

>> Finishing Up The Wheels & Brakes...

rv8iator

Joined: 11 Apr 2006
Posts: 143
Location: Newberg, OR

Posted: Fri May 29, 2009 5:22 am Post subject: Mounting The Engine...

Matt...



I am about the same place on my -8 QB and doing the same assembly sequence.  Since the engine mount attaches to the longerons there is little stress induced into the skin at the firewall.  The load from the engine mount is distributed to the skin progressivly from the firewall aft.

I would have the cowl attach hinge mounted to the firewall since any thing that you mount to the engine side may complicate adding the hinge later.  This will also allow you to take out the temporary "pop" rivets and rivit in the hinge.  Actually there are very few items that pass through the fire wall that can't be accessed after skinning the forward area.  On our first -8 build we hung the engine and did all wiring after fully completing the fuse.  No real problems doing it that way.  Plenty of access to everything.



Chris Stone

RV-8

Newberg, OR

 	  Quote: 	
		  



Dear Listers,



I'm getting close to mounting the engine on the 'ol RV-8.  I'd like to hold off riveting the front top skin on until I'm sure all of the wiring and what not works with the various engine sensors.  Is it "safe" to mount the engine before this skin is in place?  Also, I have a QB and I noticed that none of the rivets along the sides where the cowl hinges go are riveted save for a couple of temporary pop rivets.  Can the engine be mounted before these two areas are completely riveted?



Thanks!



Matt Dralle

RV-8 #82880 N998RV

Finishing Up The Wheels & Brakes...

_________________
C. Stone (RV8iator)

jfogarty(at)tds.net
Guest

Posted: Fri May 29, 2009 10:22 am Post subject: Mounting The Engine...

How many cleco's do you have?  "I wouldn't do it."



Jim

RV9a building

---

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