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Building as a way for a non-pilot to get into aviation?
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gboothe5(at)comcast.net
Guest

Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2007 1:06 pm Post subject: Building as a way for a non-pilot to get into aviation?

William,  

   

Ditto…you can build a Pietenpol for around $10k. You can also buy them for around the same, plus they are easy to fly. I also think that 30k is way high.  

     

Gary Boothe 

 Cool, CA 

 601 HDSTD, WW Conversion 90% done, 

 Tail done, wings done, working on c-section       

  

From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of William Dominguez

 Sent: Thursday, September 27, 2007 12:16 PM

 To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com

 Subject: Re: Re: Building as a way for a non-pilot to get into aviation?  

  

   

Don't misinterpret me, I'm not trying to get into a contest here. My project will take whatever it will take. I just want to understand where I have it wrong in my estimate if any. I believe you have better reason than the ones you have provide so far but you have not giving me these reasons and I would like to know them.  In other words, I want to know what is your basis to state that it wont come for less than 30K. If you don't mind, I want to know your reasons and not just "this is the way it is".

 

 Feel free to answer me off list if you wish.

 

 

 William Dominguez

 Zodiac 601XL Plans

 Miami, Florida

 

 

 

 n85ae <n85ae(at)yahoo.com> wrote:  

--> Zenith-List message posted by: "n85ae" 

 

 Well, I don't gain anything by your not building a plane so there's 

 nothing for me to win here. I'm    	  Quote: 	
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       [quote][b]

bill_dom(at)yahoo.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2007 1:07 pm Post subject: Building as a way for a non-pilot to get into aviation?

Thanks. As Paul also said, is all the little things. The devil is always in the details.



William Dominguez

Zodiac 601XL Plans

Miami Florida

http://williamdominguez.myphotoalbum.com



n85ae <n85ae(at)yahoo.com> wrote:[quote] --> Zenith-List message posted by: "n85ae" 



My kids some times say, Dad you're so stupid, right after I tell them 

something, so I just say uh-huh. 



What you are missing, is the myriad of little things that make a plane.

Everything from little fasteners, to the cost of paint, etc, etc, etc. Since

you have NOT built one, and a bunch of people on this list have, my 

best advice is to consider that several of us are saying the same thing.



If I built another plane (third) based [quote][b]

Heatonhe36(at)msn.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2007 1:19 pm Post subject: Building as a way for a non-pilot to get into aviation?

<?xml:namespace prefix="v" /><?xml:namespace prefix="o" /><![endif]-->  Bill,

  

 I have to agree with you.  I'm at $10,000 for the entire airframe  including the turbo Subaru and tools.  I still have to buy the instruments  and radio, but that shouldn't be more than $5,000.  I think plans building  is much cheaper than any other method as long as you are willing to scrounge for  material and willing to put in a lot of time making what ever you need.   Besides, it is very satisfying to know you made every part in the plane with  your own hands.

  

 Herb Heaton

 Zodiac 601XL Plans

 Colorado Springs, CO

 [quote]   ---

purplemoon99(at)bellsouth
Guest

Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2007 1:41 pm Post subject: Building as a way for a non-pilot to get into aviation?

Jeff, that's the way I feel also, so I say again" go for it" and find our 

for himself . Ijust want to know does he want the 150.00 used prop or the 

1500.00 new Prince P- TIP the good brakes  or the so,so ones  The 150.00 

hand held or the1000.00 I-Com the regular exhaust  pipes or the custom 

built,tuned ,cermaic coated ,the painted engine frame,or the powder coated 

one and the list goes on and on.... again I say it, and I mean it The best 

of luck to you both. By the way ,if you want talk to some one that can tell 

you every thing,and any thing, that you want to know about scratch builbing 

get Larry Mc farland to give some in put. To me he knows alot, there there 

are more people on here that can  give you the correct info, he has helped 

me greatly  , I'am not a scratch builder,but he is go on his web site and 

look at his plane,and his work., that's a airplane..         Joe N101HD 601 

XL/RAM

---

graeme(at)coletoolcentre.
Guest

Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2007 2:26 pm Post subject: Building as a way for a non-pilot to get into aviation?

I have recently started scratch building a Ch 701. In australia 6061T6

is expensive  but all the alloy for the project will cost less than $3500 

aus.

plus main gear leg $400.

I started halfway throught August 2007 and work week nights approx 2-2.5 hrs 

most nights.

I have all wing ribs, nose ribs, finished, main spar cut marker up and 

drilled, stab and elevator spar cut and bent, rudder upright cut and bent, 

wing rear pieces made.

I expect to have it finished with a S/H 912 80hp Rotax for approx $20000 

aus.

a ch701 fuse kit landed in Australia is over $25000aus.



I own a CH701 which I rebuilt and re engined with a  S/H 912 80hp after a 

GSC propellor Failure.



I will be upgrading the 912 by fitting 912extra pistons $1000 aus and hope 

to get 90 plus HP for same weight.



Graeme Cairns



  From: "n85ae" <n85ae(at)yahoo.com>

To: <zenith-list(at)matronics.com>

Sent: Friday, September 28, 2007 6:07 AM

Subject: Re: Building as a way for a non-pilot to get into 

aviation?

 	  Quote: 	
		   



 My kids some times say, Dad you're so stupid, right after I tell them

 something, so I just say uh-huh. 



 What you are missing, is the myriad of little things that make a plane.

 Everything from little fasteners, to the cost of paint, etc, etc, etc. 

 Since

 you have NOT built one, and a bunch of people on this list have, my

 best advice is to consider that several of us are saying the same thing.



 If I built another plane (third) based on your specs I'm guessing I would

 have a minimal VFR airplane which cost me mid thirties to build, and

 4 years labor based on my available time to do these kinds of things.



 I would build from a kit, because the $10K you will save making your

 own parts, isn't worth the number of hours you will spend doing it. I have

 a friend building a Bearhawk from plans, who spent more than a year

 forming parts for his wings ... When he was done, he was at the same

 point a kit builder starts from on day 1.



 Best Regards,

 Jeff





 Read this topic online here:



 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=136855#136855





 -- 

 27/09/2007 5:00 PM

msherman95632(at)yahoo.co
Guest

Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2007 2:55 pm Post subject: Building as a way for a non-pilot to get into aviation?

Well you guys made me do it.  I have put off adding up my list of expenses to build my 701 for a long time now.  The wife is at work so I can bring in from the shop, the 2" thick folder of invoices I have gathered up over the last six years, and add them up.

 

I was shooting for something in the $35,000.00 range when I started this project.  This 701 is a pre-SP aircraft, so I have spent a fair amount of money to bring it as close as I can to the new SP.  Bought  the parts from Zenith for about $1,500.00 with shipping , this is included in the supplies cost.  

 

This is certainly not a basic aircraft, if I wanted it, I bought it, but I shopped for a good price.  Had to replace a few parts I messed up, that is included in the supplies cost.

 

My 701 is completed with just painting to go.

 

The kit was        $13,135.00

The FWF           $16,000.00  SkyShops 912ULS

The inst. panel   $5,700.00   EIS/steam gages/ Valcom radio/GTX320A transponder/Intercom

Paint                 $900.00

Supplies            $4,000.00  This includes all the electrical wires, fuel lines ( all hard plumbed with A&N fittings), cables/turnbuckles and lighting.  Also alodine, alumaprep and primer for all of the interior parts.

 

This brings me to about $39,735.00.  Just for the airplane.  I spent about $1,200.00 for tools related just to the airplane.

 

If you were to scratch build this same airplane I would guess you could save about $6,000.00.  Everything else I would still need to build this aircraft.



Mark Sherman

701/912ULS

Galt, CA

Don't let your dream ride pass you by. Make it a reality with Yahoo! Autos.

http://autos.yahoo.com/index.html

planecrazydld(at)yahoo.co
Guest

Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2007 3:21 pm Post subject: Building as a way for a non-pilot to get into aviation?

...just read about someone who estimated their completed FWB at about $5k.



do not archive

 

Dave Downey

  Harleysville (SE) PA

  100 HP Corvair



---

Ron Lendon

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 685
Location: Clinton Twp., MI

Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2007 7:13 pm Post subject: Re: Building as a way for a non-pilot to get into aviation?

Here is what I have so far.  Rudder, Stab and Elevator, Ailerons, Flaps, Center Spar, all wing ribs and spars, one left wing  ready to store.  The material is in with the Shop Supplies.



Avionics	1090.96

Books	124.11

DVD's	80

Electrical	274.7

Empennage	261.05

Engine	2844.68

Facilities	2684.8

Miscellaneous	708.1

Planning	395

Shop Supplies	4338.21

Subscriptions	70

Tools	4210.8

Wings	2348.12

TOTAL	19430.53

TAXES	474.75





All and all it's more than my flight training cost with the 3 instructors and rental aircraft.  I soled 3 times, (once for each instructor), getting my PPL.  



With all the money spend so far I only have half of an airplane built.  But I have to tell you, Im having a lot of fun.  The cost has been spread out over two years so far, and I still need radio and plan on using the Dynon 180 in the panel.



do not archive

_________________
Ron Lendon
WW Corvair with Roy's Garage 5th bearing
CH 601 XLB
N601LT - Flying
http://www.mykitlog.com/rlendon
Corvair Engine Prints:
https://sites.google.com/site/corvairenginedata/

purplemoon99(at)bellsouth
Guest

Posted: Fri Sep 28, 2007 6:26 am Post subject: Building as a way for a non-pilot to get into aviation?

Look,s to be a good list. What kind of engine did you get for $2844.68 ? 

N101HD  601XL?RAM

---

Ron Lendon

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 685
Location: Clinton Twp., MI

Posted: Fri Sep 28, 2007 5:27 pm Post subject: Re: Building as a way for a non-pilot to get into aviation?

The engine is a corvair, still need  pistons and cylinders and all the other HW.  Have the crank and the heads ready for flight with the WW gold hub and ring gear.

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