Matronics Email Lists :: View topic

Matronics Email Lists
Web Forum Interface to the Matronics Email Lists

Get Email Distribution Too! FAQ Search Memberlist Usergroups Register

Profile Log in to check your private messages Log in

Door seal info

Matronics Email Lists Forum Index -> RV10-List

View previous topic :: View next topic

Author Message

Deems Davis

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 925

Posted: Fri Aug 07, 2009 3:18 pm Post subject: Door seal info

It was great seeing everyone (at) OSH this year, and a special thanks to 

Gary,Bob and all who set up RV10 HQ and organized the dinners. Judy and 

I returned yesterday after continuing on to Long Island NY from OSH.



Several people inquired about the door seals on N519PJ. 1st I should 

acknowledge Sheril Hilton and Robin Marks for their innovation on this 

idea, and Ed Hayden for kicking me in the pants to 'quit thinking about 

it and just Do It!' I'm very happy with the results.



The door seal material is available from McMaster Carr



McMaster Carr p/n 1120A311



http://www.mcmaster.com/#1120a311/=3390lx



I bought a 100ft roll and sold 30 ft to another -10 builder. I've got 

enough left over to do 2 more doors. I cut up an initial 12 ft section 

into pieces of various size/lengths to use  during the trial and error 

process of removing the cabin cover 'curved edge' fiberglass to provide 

the right clearance between the cabin cover and the closed door. Like Ed 

H. I found that it was necessary to glue the seal on, and after 

experimenting with several 'contact like cements' I ended up using Pro 

Seal, which works great. If you scan down this page 

http://deemsrv10.com/Homelogindex.html you will find several entries 

which describe the process I used to close out the door hinges to 

complete the seal. I helped another -10 builder here in AZ to do the same.

Deems Davis N519PJ

http://deemsrv10.com/

fdombroski

Joined: 14 Mar 2009
Posts: 33
Location: Westfield NJ

Posted: Thu Aug 13, 2009 7:13 am Post subject: Re: Door seal info

Hi Deems, do you think the smaller diameter material (1/8" tube) would require less install grinding, but still seal the door?



Thanks,

Frank

_________________
Frank Dombroski
Multiple Offender RV-8, 7A, 10 x 2
RV-10 2.0 N46VT 2015
KSMQ Somerset Airport NJ

Deems Davis

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 925

Posted: Thu Aug 13, 2009 9:17 am Post subject: Door seal info

I think it would we worth a try. I don't see anything that would prevent 

it. You would have to be more accurate and careful as you removed 

material, but I think it should worl as long as that channel is the same 

size as the intial. You could always order a 13 ft piece and try it.



Deems Davis



fdombroski wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   



 Hi Deems, do you think the smaller diameter material (1/8" tube) would require less install grinding, but still seal the door?



 Thanks,

 Frank



 --------

 Frank Dombroski

 RV-10 N46WD Flying

 RV-8 N84FD final assembly

 N40 Sky Manor Airport





 Read this topic online here:



 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p 57480#257480

aerosport1

Joined: 07 Nov 2007
Posts: 231

Posted: Thu Aug 13, 2009 11:24 am Post subject: Door seal info

Frank I do not think 1/8" would be wise if you need to grind down the flange

more to accommodate for the smaller attach thickness 1/8". That flange

Gives good strength to the fiber glass top. I actually made my flanges for a

1/4" instead of the 3/16". 

Just my thoughts.



Geoff Combs

President

Aerosport Modeling & Design

8090 Howe Industrial Parkway 

Canal Winchester, Ohio 43110

614-834-5227p

614-834-5230f

www.aerosportmodeling.com

--

_________________
Geoff Combs
RV-10 QB N829GW
Flying 500 hrs
40033

robin1(at)mrmoisture.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Aug 13, 2009 11:42 am Post subject: Door seal info

Everyone can make their own choices as to what materials & dimensions

however I can tell you I am totally satisfied with our door seal set up

(exactly like Deems) and would not change our configuration. 



Robin

Do Not Archive 



--

rv10builder(at)verizon.ne
Guest

Posted: Thu Aug 13, 2009 12:22 pm Post subject: Door seal info

I had a heck of a time getting the doors to be flush with the stock Van's 

seals, how in the world did you get a flush fit with a larger seal? the idea 

is to get a good seal without needing to do major work to have the doors 

flush, the idea of 1/8 seal takes nothing away from the flange or anything 

else, unless it is not large enough, in my case it would have been fine 

since the doors were 3/16 out with the seals, 1/8th would have worked great 

for me in retrospect, but it works just fine now with the stock seals.

So fit the doors perfectly with the flanges than fit the seals, assure there 

is no gaps whatever size is used and call it success, 3/16 IS too much 

however without needing work.

Pascal



--------------------------------------------------

From: "Geoff Combs" <g.combs(at)aerosportmodeling.com>

Sent: Thursday, August 13, 2009 12:22 PM

To: <rv10-list(at)matronics.com>

Subject: RE: Re: Door seal info



[quote] 

 <g.combs(at)aerosportmodeling.com>



 Frank I do not think 1/8" would be wise if you need to grind down the 

 flange

 more to accommodate for the smaller attach thickness 1/8". That flange

 Gives good strength to the fiber glass top. I actually made my flanges for 

 a

 1/4" instead of the 3/16".

 Just my thoughts.



 Geoff Combs

 President

 Aerosport Modeling & Design

 8090 Howe Industrial Parkway

 Canal Winchester, Ohio 43110

 614-834-5227p

 614-834-5230f

 www.aerosportmodeling.com

 --

drfred(at)suddenlinkmail.
Guest

Posted: Thu Aug 13, 2009 1:55 pm Post subject: Door seal info

Pascal;



I had to redo the fiberglass and drop the sill down enough to get the 

seal to fit.  You add more layers to the underside and then grind down 

the top.  I got the pleasure of seeing Deem's work at Osh last week.  I 

really think that the process that he describes on his website and what 

he has done to the hinge area are as good as we can do with this 

design.  I had a fair door fit before I put the seals on, but then could 

not close the door as the seal pushed up and took up too much room.  

Pulling the lip down enough to get it to seal fixed the problem.  I 

don't have the gaps filled around the hinges and do not seem to have any 

significant water or wind thru the gap.  I wish I had started out with 

the seals from Mc Master Carr and had them at the time of initial door 

fitting.  It would have been a whole lot easier to do before I had the 

wings on and had to keep all the dust out of the avionics.



Dr Fred



Pascal wrote:

[quote] 



 I had a heck of a time getting the doors to be flush with the stock 

 Van's seals, how in the world did you get a flush fit with a larger 

 seal? the idea is to get a good seal without needing to do major work 

 to have the doors flush, the idea of 1/8 seal takes nothing away from 

 the flange or anything else, unless it is not large enough, in my case 

 it would have been fine since the doors were 3/16 out with the seals, 

 1/8th would have worked great for me in retrospect, but it works just 

 fine now with the stock seals.

 So fit the doors perfectly with the flanges than fit the seals, assure 

 there is no gaps whatever size is used and call it success, 3/16 IS 

 too much however without needing work.

 Pascal



 --------------------------------------------------

 From: "Geoff Combs" <g.combs(at)aerosportmodeling.com>

 Sent: Thursday, August 13, 2009 12:22 PM

 To: <rv10-list(at)matronics.com>

 Subject: RE: Re: Door seal info



> 

> <g.combs(at)aerosportmodeling.com>

>

> Frank I do not think 1/8" would be wise if you need to grind down the 

> flange

> more to accommodate for the smaller attach thickness 1/8". That flange

> Gives good strength to the fiber glass top. I actually made my 

> flanges for a

> 1/4" instead of the 3/16".

> Just my thoughts.

>

> Geoff Combs

> President

> Aerosport Modeling & Design

> 8090 Howe Industrial Parkway

> Canal Winchester, Ohio 43110

> 614-834-5227p

> 614-834-5230f

> www.aerosportmodeling.com

> --

kearney

Joined: 20 Sep 2008
Posts: 563

Posted: Thu Aug 13, 2009 2:41 pm Post subject: Door seal info

Hi Pascal



The McMaster Carr seals require that you grind down the canopy door flanges

until they are parallel to the door. The seal fit on this flange with the

bulb against the door. 



This gives a great seal. I don't see how you can get a good result by

fitting the doors first and then fitting the seals. Any kind of seal will

impact the door geometry. 



As I understand it, the preferred course of action is to fit the doors with

seals in place and then use epoxy etc to give a flush fit all the way

around, feathering out to give a smooth transition between the door and the

canopy. Doing this before the seals are installed just means more rework. 



Today I spent several hours getting my second door to fit (the first worked

out very nicely right off the bat). Ultimately I had to shim the two delrin

door blocks so as to provide a bit more space between the door and the

seals. Now the doors close easily although I will need a pull strap in the

center of the door to pull the door into the opening. A couple of pounds of

pull in the center of the door is all that I need. 



I don't like the idea of using the door handle to pull the door closed as it

doesn't seem like it was designed to take that kind of twisting pull. That's

just my $0.02 though.



Cheers



Les

#40643 - fitting doors & seals 



--

pitts_pilot(at)bellsouth.
Guest

Posted: Thu Aug 13, 2009 2:51 pm Post subject: Door seal info

Les Kearney wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   



 Hi Pascal



 The McMaster Carr seals require that you grind down the canopy door flanges

 until they are parallel to the door. The seal fit on this flange with the

 bulb against the door. 

   

Which begs the question:  Why not attach the door seal to the door 
	


instead of the cabin top??

Linn

do not archive

 	  Quote: 	
		   This gives a great seal. I don't see how you can get a good result by

 fitting the doors first and then fitting the seals. Any kind of seal will

 impact the door geometry. 



 As I understand it, the preferred course of action is to fit the doors with

 seals in place and then use epoxy etc to give a flush fit all the way

 around, feathering out to give a smooth transition between the door and the

 canopy. Doing this before the seals are installed just means more rework. 



 Today I spent several hours getting my second door to fit (the first worked

 out very nicely right off the bat). Ultimately I had to shim the two delrin

 door blocks so as to provide a bit more space between the door and the

 seals. Now the doors close easily although I will need a pull strap in the

 center of the door to pull the door into the opening. A couple of pounds of

 pull in the center of the door is all that I need. 



 I don't like the idea of using the door handle to pull the door closed as it

 doesn't seem like it was designed to take that kind of twisting pull. That's

 just my $0.02 though.



 Cheers



 Les

 #40643 - fitting doors & seals

kearney

Joined: 20 Sep 2008
Posts: 563

Posted: Thu Aug 13, 2009 4:00 pm Post subject: Door seal info

Linn



Here is a link to the door seals.

http://www.mcmaster.com/#door-seals/=36cwot



It would be tough to make this work on a door given that it is designed to

be edge mounted. Besides, this trims off the door opening very nicely -

aesthetics count!



Cheers



Les

#40643 - living in a fibreglass world



--

effectus(at)rogers.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Aug 13, 2009 4:52 pm Post subject: Door seal info

I agree with Les, Robin and Deems. The door seal on the canopy flange is THE way to go!



It is a bunch more work but I think it gives the aircraft a much more finished look where impressions count the most. I also saw Deem's plane at OSH and the door opening was finished way better than the others I saw.



Dave



--

fdombroski

Joined: 14 Mar 2009
Posts: 33
Location: Westfield NJ

Posted: Sat Aug 15, 2009 5:48 pm Post subject: Re: Door seal info

I am going to order both sizes, and will report back in a couple of weeks if the 1/8" bulb works out.  The flange size is the same.  The stock seals are not doing the job, so back to the dust buster...



Thanks all.

_________________
Frank Dombroski
Multiple Offender RV-8, 7A, 10 x 2
RV-10 2.0 N46VT 2015
KSMQ Somerset Airport NJ

Display posts from previous:

	Matronics Email Lists Forum Index -> RV10-List	All times are GMT - 8 Hours
Page 1 of 1

Jump to:

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum