 |
Matronics Email Lists
Web Forum Interface to the Matronics Email Lists
|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
barryhancock
Joined: 09 Oct 2008
Posts: 285
|
 Posted: Fri Oct 09, 2009 5:47 pm Post subject: Re: smoke systems |
 |
|
Keith, if you can do it for that...go for it! The "custom" systems I'm talking about are those installed by other shops. Complexity and quality always play a role...
Barry
| | - The Matronics Yak-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List |
|
_________________
Barry Hancock
Worldwide Warbirds, Inc.
www.worldwidewarbirds.com |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
ReadeG(at)Cairnwood.com
Guest
|
| Posted: Mon Oct 12, 2009 6:44 pm Post subject: Smoke Systems |
|
|
Anyone have the Termikas fabricated smoke system installed? I am flying
a 52TD with their system and it works quite well. I have no
documentation, however (capacity - which I have figured pretty close,
type of pump, pressures, etc.). Any information would be greatly
appreciated.
BTW - it is plumbed into both stacks and makes lots of smoke - a good
portion of which ends up in the cockpit. I am gap sealing everything
imaginable!
Reade Genzlinger
Cairnwood Cooperative Corporation
mailto:readeg(at)cairnwood.com
215.914.0370
| | - The Matronics Yak-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List |
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
dougsappllc(at)gmail.com
Guest
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 13, 2009 5:22 am Post subject: Smoke Systems |
|
|
Reade,More gain will come from pressurizing the cockpit with fresh ram air than trying to seal the cockpit against smoke entering it. Once you equal or exceed the pressure outside when compared the the pressure inside the smoke will become a non issue.
Doug
On Mon, Oct 12, 2009 at 7:43 PM, Genzlinger, Reade <ReadeG(at)cairnwood.com (ReadeG(at)cairnwood.com)> wrote:
| Quote: | --> Yak-List message posted by: "Genzlinger, Reade" <ReadeG(at)Cairnwood.com>
Anyone have the Termikas fabricated smoke system installed? I am flying
a 52TD with their system and it works quite well. I have no
documentation, however (capacity - which I have figured pretty close,
type of pump, pressures, etc.). Any information would be greatly
appreciated.
BTW - it is plumbed into both stacks and makes lots of smoke - a good
portion of which ends up in the cockpit. I am gap sealing everything
imaginable!
Reade Genzlinger
Cairnwood Cooperative Corporation
mailto:readeg(at)cairnwood.com (readeg(at)cairnwood.com)
215.914.0370
===========
rget="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List
===========
http://forums.matronics.com
===========
le, List Admin.
="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
===========
|
--
Douglas Sapp
Doug Sapp LLC
18B Riverview Road
Omak WA 98841
PH 509-826-4610
Fax 509-826-3644
[quote][b]
| | - The Matronics Yak-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List |
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Mozam
Joined: 24 Nov 2006
Posts: 85
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 13, 2009 5:59 am Post subject: Re: smoke systems |
|
|
Hi Reade,
I was finding myself blinded by smoke in the cockpit during our airshow routine. Makes it real hard to hang on the wing during loops and rolls! Photos showed that I (sitting in the cockpit) was not able to be seen by someone outside the plane because I was completely engulfed in smoke (and CO!!).
Through much experimentation, here is what worked for me to greatly reduce the smoke level in the cockpit:
-Drop the lower panels where the wings and fuselage attach. Put a bright light in each cockpit and crawl under the plane. Now you can see every gap to seal. I used very light weight aluminum tape I bought at Lowes. You can skip your Pilates class that day...you'll see what I mean. 
-With any g loading above 1 g, the pilot's right side exhaust comes up over the wing (and into the cockpit). The more AOA (g loading), the more smoke over the wing. I greatly reduced my problem by removing that injector. The difference in smoke produced is undetectable in video tapes make before and after. I highly recommend a Smoking Airplane's injector. I never got a home made one to work as well, and I tried a LOT of them. Not to say good home made ones don't exist, but I never got one to work.
-Do not put the one injector high up in the exhaust system. Smoke leaks out of every joint and finds its way into the cockpit.
Doing all the above will significantly reduce your cockpit smoke levels. Beware however, during hammerheads, tumbles and such, you cannot help but get some smoke in the cockpit. You just cannot totally eliminate it.
I hope we see your TD back East, flying with us next summer,
Steve
| | - The Matronics Yak-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List |
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
william(at)netpros.net
Guest
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 13, 2009 8:11 am Post subject: Smoke Systems |
|
|
Good point - sealing exhaust gaps did not work in my 55 either ...
+--
| | - The Matronics Yak-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List |
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
viperdoc(at)mindspring.co
Guest
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 13, 2009 6:29 pm Post subject: Smoke Systems |
|
|
Having done a number of CO studies on the 52 and the 50, Doug is correct.
Just sealing the exhaust gaps will not stop CO getting into the cockpit. The
52 however does have a positive pressure airflow via the trumpet receiving
fresh air from the nose of the aircraft. That is not enough to stop CO from
getting into the cockpit. Although the 52 does on average have less CO in
the cockpit than the 50. I have a different theory on why that is. It has to
do with the open hole that the tail wheel strut extends out of in the tail.
With airflow over the canopy, the pressure in the cockpit is decreased. That
creates a decrease in pressure in the aft fuselage sucking CO into the
aircraft. The CO also leaches into the cockpit through leaks in fairings
along with holes in the gear wells of the 50. This all driven by the lower
pressure inside the cockpit.
The CO is highest during engine start, run-up, high alpha maneuvers
in-flight, on landing, and during run-up to scavenge the sump. On average I
see levels as high as 50 ppm for the 52 and as high as 110 ppm in the 52.
After a while, I gave up on trying to block all of the CO out of the
aircraft and opted for a fresh air source that was 100% free of CO. That was
accomplished with using a scuba system and by using my MBU-12 aviators mask.
I only use the system for taxi, take off, landing and run-up for shut down.
Basically, I feel better after 2 or 3 sorties than I did before I went to
this system.
I have not tested the CJ with or without the NACA duct installed to vent air
into the cockpit.
Doc
--
| | - The Matronics Yak-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List |
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum
|
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group
|
Get Email Distribution Too!
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
