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Wing repair

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edgraydallas

Joined: 13 Jun 2008
Posts: 74
Location: Dallas, Tx

Posted: Mon Mar 29, 2010 8:00 am Post subject: Wing repair

My 2 cents worth on the wing repair.  Building new Model 4 wings is a good

idea if financially feasible.  I would want to uncover the damaged wing to

inspect for other damage.  If replacing the spar, how about sawing of the

front half of the old spar, leaving the ribs in place, then attaching a new

spar with rivets and cement.  It would only add the thickness of the spar

material (.035 inches ?) to the chord of the wing, and would save lots of

time and add only a pound or two.



Before covering my model 4 wings, I have decided to make the "quick tip"

mod, making the outer bay of the wing removable for conversion to

"Speedster" wing.  Who has done this and who has any comments/advice.

Please post here or email me - don't be shy. 



Ed Gray Dallas KF2 582 and Model 4 building and looking for 100 hp engine

and fwf

Do not archive



--

leach(at)infogen.net.nz
Guest

Posted: Mon Mar 29, 2010 12:10 pm Post subject: Wing repair

My 2 cents worth also.  I have built an Avid but have never tried to repair

a wing.  I would try what Ed Gray suggested and cut the spar in half

lengthwise with an angle grinder and cutting disc. Aluminium cuts very

easily with these discs.  But don't try and fit the new spar inside what is

left of the old one.  This would be very messy and they wont fit neatly

together anyway.  Use a grinding disc and grind the aluminium away from the

inside of the spar at each rib.  The heat generated will help release the

glue and the whole operation would be completely stress free on the delicate

wing structure.  It would be a lot of work, but a lot less than building

another wing.  As I said, I have never tried doing this but it might work.



Brian.

marwynne(at)windstream.ne
Guest

Posted: Mon Mar 29, 2010 2:19 pm Post subject: Wing repair

Splitting the spar will cause the spar to spring open wider .  I bet you will damage the ribs doing that

---

dave

Joined: 22 Sep 2006
Posts: 1382

Posted: Mon Mar 29, 2010 2:58 pm Post subject: Re: Wing repair

Guys , Get a grip here. 

You want to take a bent un- airworthy spar and  dissect it and epoxy and rivet another tube to it  ?



Fix it properly or  the plane will  become a lawn ornament.



Hard to believe that anyone would try to re-engineer a damaged part instead of doing a proper repair.

_________________
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Pat Reilly

Joined: 06 Aug 2009
Posts: 345

Posted: Mon Mar 29, 2010 3:34 pm Post subject: Wing repair

Sounds to me like it would be safer to just ignore the dent than attempt to fix it with the patch work methods I've seen here.

  

 Pat Reilly

 Mod 3 582 Rebuild

 Rockford, IL

 On Mon, Mar 29, 2010 at 4:06 PM, Brian Leach <leach(at)infogen.net.nz (leach(at)infogen.net.nz)> wrote:

  	  Quote: 	
		  --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Brian Leach" <leach(at)infogen.net.nz (leach(at)infogen.net.nz)>

 

My 2 cents worth also.  I have built an Avid but have never tried to repair

a wing.  I would try what Ed Gray suggested and cut the spar in half

lengthwise with an angle grinder and cutting disc. Aluminium cuts very

 easily with these discs.  But don't try and fit the new spar inside what is

left of the old one.  This would be very messy and they wont fit neatly

together anyway.  Use a grinding disc and grind the aluminium away from the

 inside of the spar at each rib.  The heat generated will help release the

glue and the whole operation would be completely stress free on the delicate

wing structure.  It would be a lot of work, but a lot less than building

 another wing.  As I said, I have never tried doing this but it might workist Features Navigator to browse

 s.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List

 ronics.com/" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com

 Matt Dralle, List Admin.

 =====



	




 

-- 

Pat Reilly

Mod 3 582 Rebuild

Rockford,IL

  [quote][b]

leach(at)infogen.net.nz
Guest

Posted: Mon Mar 29, 2010 4:49 pm Post subject: Wing repair

Pat Reilly and Dave.   I think you have  both misunderstood my post.  I was suggesting a way of completely removing  the old spar without stressing the rest of the wing structure, so that the new  spar could be glued in.  If the old spar could be successfully removed  without damaging the ribs the end result would be the same as a new wing.  

  

 Brian. 

 [quote]   From:    Patrick    Reilly (patreilly43(at)gmail.com) 

   To: kitfox-list(at)matronics.com (kitfox-list(at)matronics.com) 

   Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2010 11:33    AM

   Subject: Re: Wing    repair

   



   Sounds to me like it would be safer to just ignore the dent than attempt    to fix it with the patch work methods I've seen here.

    

   Pat Reilly

   Mod 3 582 Rebuild

   Rockford, IL

   On Mon, Mar 29, 2010 at 4:06 PM, Brian Leach <leach(at)infogen.net.nz (leach(at)infogen.net.nz)> wrote:

    	  Quote: 	
		  -->      Kitfox-List message posted by: "Brian Leach" <leach(at)infogen.net.nz (leach(at)infogen.net.nz)>



My 2 cents worth also.       I have built an Avid but have never tried to repair

a wing.  I      would try what Ed Gray suggested and cut the spar in half

lengthwise with      an angle grinder and cutting disc. Aluminium cuts very

easily with these      discs.  But don't try and fit the new spar inside what is

left of      the old one.  This would be very messy and they wont fit      neatly

together anyway.  Use a grinding disc and grind the aluminium      away from the

inside of the spar at each rib.  The heat generated      will help release the

glue and the whole operation would be completely      stress free on the delicate

wing structure.  It would be a lot of      work, but a lot less than building

another wing.  As I said, I have      never tried doing this but it might workist Features Navigator to      browse

s.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List"      target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List

ronics.com/"      target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com

Matt Dralle, List      Admin.

=====



	


--    

Pat Reilly

Mod 3 582 Rebuild

Rockford,IL

 	  Quote: 	
		  



href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List">http://www.matronhref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com

href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c

	
[b]

dave

Joined: 22 Sep 2006
Posts: 1382

Posted: Mon Mar 29, 2010 4:59 pm Post subject: Re: Wing repair

Brian,  Yes replace the entire front spar.  But who knows what lurks inside.   It is a huge job regardless.  I just hope that the fellow that was looking at buying this plane knows  that the plane is not  structurally as sound as it should be. 



Plenty of Kitfox for sale< why fix a bent one when you can buy one that is airworthy now unless is it cost effective. ?

dave

Joined: 22 Sep 2006
Posts: 1382

Posted: Mon Mar 29, 2010 5:01 pm Post subject: Re: Wing repair

Pat - what are you saying here?   Ignore the damage? 

>>Sounds to me like it would be safer to just ignore the dent than attempt toï¿½fix it with the patch workï¿½methods I've seenï¿½here.

ï¿½

Pat Reilly <

leach(at)infogen.net.nz
Guest

Posted: Mon Mar 29, 2010 8:28 pm Post subject: Wing repair

Dave

I think it goes without saying that with any damage like this the fabric

must be torn off, the entire wing inspected and the spar replaced.  The

point that I was making is that if you can carefully cut the old spar out

without damaging the ribs, and carefully support everything so you don't

change the washout, then you should be able to make a perfect repair that

would be a lot less time and money than building a complete new wing.  This

is assuming there is no other damage except for the dented spar.  But as

somebody else said, if you haven't already built one of these wings, don't

even think about doing it.  Anybody thinking about buying this aeroplane

would certainly want to see inside the wing before making a decision to buy

it.



Brian.

---

lcfitt(at)sbcglobal.net
Guest

Posted: Tue Mar 30, 2010 7:59 am Post subject: Wing repair

I guess it is OK to agree and disagree.  I liked Brian's method of removing 

the front spar.  Cutting the spar into sections and then adressing each rib 

individually seems to be a great idea.  Doing the repair without having wing 

building experience would eliminate most of us that built after about 1995 

or so when the quick build wing came out.  I don't see any more challenge 

with the repair than building a wing, and the wing building was formerly 

done many times with only an instruction manual as help.  I would say, 

however, if the repair guy doesn't have much experience with tools, then 

look for some help somewhere.  Removing the fabric?  I think that would be 

necessary simply from the sake of fabric integrity.  It would also be good 

experience for understanding and maintaining the airplane down the road.



Lowell

---

edgraydallas

Joined: 13 Jun 2008
Posts: 74
Location: Dallas, Tx

Posted: Tue Mar 30, 2010 8:49 am Post subject: wing repair

Lots of interesting ideas on the bent wing spar.  I will clarify what I had

in mind.  I don't think splitting the old spar would harm the ribs, but if

so, that could be avoided by putting a kerf near the attach point for each

rib.  If you totally detach all ribs from the spar, the wing will lose its

shape and require some sort of jig.  If you lay it out flat and shim for the

washout, you could leave only a skeleton of the old spar, not necessarily

half of it, but avoid detaching all the ribs and basically starting all

over.  You could preserve the dimensions and washout and attach a new tube

with cement and rivets, no big mess that I can foresee.  I certainly would

not just "go fly it and hope its ok".  That's my 2 sense worth, but I aint

no enjunear.

Do not archive

Ed Gray K2  and K4 building Dallas



--

Pat Reilly

Joined: 06 Aug 2009
Posts: 345

Posted: Tue Mar 30, 2010 5:47 pm Post subject: Wing repair

Brian, Now that makes sense.

 do not archive

 Pat Reilly

 On Mon, Mar 29, 2010 at 8:44 PM, Brian Leach <leach(at)infogen.net.nz (leach(at)infogen.net.nz)> wrote:

  	  Quote: 	
		    Pat Reilly and Dave.   I think you have both misunderstood my post.  I was suggesting a way of completely removing the old spar without stressing the rest of the wing structure, so that the new spar could be glued in.  If the old spar could be successfully removed without damaging the ribs the end result would be the same as a new wing. 

   

 Brian. 

  	  Quote: 	
		   From: Patrick Reilly (patreilly43(at)gmail.com) 

 To: kitfox-list(at)matronics.com (kitfox-list(at)matronics.com) 

 Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2010 11:33 AM

 Subject: Re: Wing repair

  



 Sounds to me like it would be safer to just ignore the dent than attempt to fix it with the patch work methods I've seen here.

  

 Pat Reilly

 Mod 3 582 Rebuild

 Rockford, IL



  On Mon, Mar 29, 2010 at 4:06 PM, Brian Leach <leach(at)infogen.net.nz (leach(at)infogen.net.nz)> wrote:



  	  Quote: 	
		   --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Brian Leach" <leach(at)infogen.net.nz (leach(at)infogen.net.nz)>



My 2 cents worth also.  I have built an Avid but have never tried to repair

 a wing.  I would try what Ed Gray suggested and cut the spar in half

lengthwise with an angle grinder and cutting disc. Aluminium cuts very

easily with these discs.  But don't try and fit the new spar inside what is

 left of the old one.  This would be very messy and they wont fit neatly

together anyway.  Use a grinding disc and grind the aluminium away from the

inside of the spar at each rib.  The heat generated will help release the

 glue and the whole operation would be completely stress free on the delicate

wing structure.  It would be a lot of work, but a lot less than building



another wing.  As I said, I have never tried doing this but it might workist Features Navigator to browse

 s.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List

 ronics.com/" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com

Matt Dralle, List Admin.

=====

 

	


-- 

 Pat Reilly

Mod 3 582 Rebuild

Rockford,IL



 	  Quote: 	
		  



href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List">http://www.matronhref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com

href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c

	
	
  	  Quote: 	
		  



arget="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List

ttp://forums.matronics.com

_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution



	




	


-- 

Pat Reilly

Mod 3 582 Rebuild

Rockford,IL

  [quote][b]

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