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What to look for in a good Mechanic

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Roger Lee

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1464
Location: Tucson, Az.

Posted: Sun Dec 12, 2010 8:19 am Post subject: What to look for in a good Mechanic

What to look for in a good Mechanic and How do I know if I already have a good one?



This can be a dynamic topic, but there are certainly some markers to look for in finding yourself a good mechanic that you can really trust to keep you in the air, safe and happy. You say you already have a mechanic; well the same properties in looking for a mechanic apply to knowing if you have a good one. Letâ€™s take a look at what traits might make up a good mechanic and what you can do to find one.



Letâ€™s talk about looking for a good mechanic first. Just like in all professions you have marginal professionals and top of the line. Here are a few items to look for when trying to determine if a certain mechanic is right for you. 



Questions for them and to yourself before selecting this mechanic. 



(You may want to add a few extra qualifications on your own. These arenâ€™t all inclusive) 



1. Does he come recommended by other people?



2. Do you hear from others that he does a good job?



3. Does he have experience in your type aircraft?



4. Do you hear their name brought up favorably in conversations?



5. When you talk to them are they friendly and helpful before he wants to take your money?



6. Ask them if they have the SBâ€™s and all the manuals for your engine and fuselage on site?



7. How many aircraft like yours has he worked on or inspected?



8. Are they willing to show you the issues they found and answer your questions knowledgeably about your plane while in their shop?



9. Whatâ€™s his philosophy regarding regular and preventive maintenance?



10. Is he an arrogant mechanic or open minded to your ideas, suggestions, concerns and will he research problems?



11 Do they use inspection check list, discrepancy list and do good detailed logbook label entries? (possibly ask to see a couple of his labels and check list)



12. Does he document well? Itâ€™s for your benefit as well as his and he should know that.



13. Does he give you copies of the maintenance check list or other documents for your personal file? This should be an absolute in case you need it for the FAA, insurance and the re-sale of your plane. Youâ€™re paying for the work, get it the way you want it not him.



14. Does he seem to have the proper tools and education for your particular plane?



15. Last, but not least and this item is not a real marker of the mechanicâ€™s professionalism, but should be kept in the back of your mind. What do they charge? If the price sounds too good to be true then there may be a reason and you may get what you paid for. They may not be able to get much business from failings of the above items and try to low ball prices to drum up more business. Someone in a higher demand or better educated usually gets a little more money. Now I know this is not always true thatâ€™s why this is last and only something to consider while looking for a mechanic that you will get along with and do a good job for you.



A good mechanic will have a large portion and maybe if youâ€™re lucky all these traits above.



The mechanicâ€™s motto should be: I know there is something wrong with your plane (major or minor) and Iâ€™m going to find that for you to keep you safe. Due to a planeâ€™s wear and tear, loosening of attachment items or just sitting for extended periods things change on a plane and itâ€™s your mechanics job to find these. He needs to be a skilled hunter of problems and an organized repairman for these items.



You say you already have a mechanic then you should be able to use these questions to determine if he is good for you. If there are some areas above that you wish your mechanic would do better then sit down with them and explain that you would like these items addressed better in the future. You are paying these people good money and if they arenâ€™t living up to your expectations then there is nothing wrong with asking them to work on your plane a little different.



In many aspects of our life we have choices as to the way we want things, but when we go to a Doctor, a Lawyer or a Mechanic we accept or expect them to tell us what we need or want.



WRONG, we should exercise the same options with these professionals and they should be receptive to our needs and you should fully expect help, understanding, your options given and consideration to your own input. You should expect a 100% job and not 50% at a fair price for the service you receive. That said if you go cheap sometime thatâ€™s all you get. Getting a good professional is not always the cheapest fare in town, but doesnâ€™t have to be the most expensive either. Just like buying a new TV or car, shop around and get something that is quality, will last and serve you well.





This was a long story and maybe I should have started it â€œOnce upon atimeâ€, but I hope this helps someone in having a good sound relationship with their mechanic.





MERRY CHRISTMAS TO ALL MY FRIENDS HERE ON OUR FORUM! 





Roger Lee



Tucson, AZ

p.s.

If you have a good one don't forget to give them a hug!

_________________
Roger Lee
Tucson, Az.
Rotax Instructor & Rotax IRC
Light Sport Repairman
Home 520-574-1080 TRY HOME FIRST
Cell 520-349-7056

Thom Riddle

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1597
Location: Buffalo, NY, USA (9G0)

Posted: Mon Dec 13, 2010 5:51 am Post subject: Re: What to look for in a good Mechanic

Roger,



Item 15:

I'm glad you left that one open for interpretation, because my partner and I don't charge as much as most mechanics because our overhead is lower, we are both retired and do mechanic work for others because we enjoy helping them and keeping our hands in it. Plus my partner has to stay "actively engaged" to keep his I/A current. We are part-timers and we like it that way so we have an actual retirement life outside of work. If it stops being fun, I'll quit doing it.



We stay as busy as we want to with work most A&Ps around here won't touch... experimental aircraft, but also do type certificated airplane maintenance and inspection. We enjoy working on the Rotax and Jabiru engines because they are great engines but largely misunderstood by many A&Ps.

 

I'm in it for the fun and enjoyment of it in my retirement.

_________________
Thom Riddle
Buffalo, NY (9G0)

Don't worry about old age... it doesn't last very long.
- Anonymous

lucien

Joined: 03 Jun 2007
Posts: 721
Location: santa fe, NM

Posted: Mon Dec 13, 2010 6:15 am Post subject: Re: What to look for in a good Mechanic

 	  Thom Riddle wrote: 	
		  Roger,



Item 15:

I'm glad you left that one open for interpretation, because my partner and I don't charge as much as most mechanics because our overhead is lower, we are both retired and do mechanic work for others because we enjoy helping them and keeping our hands in it. Plus my partner has to stay "actively engaged" to keep his I/A current. We are part-timers and we like it that way so we have an actual retirement life outside of work. If it stops being fun, I'll quit doing it.



We stay as busy as we want to with work most A&Ps around here won't touch... experimental aircraft, but also do type certificated airplane maintenance and inspection. We enjoy working on the Rotax and Jabiru engines because they are great engines but largely misunderstood by many A&Ps.

 

I'm in it for the fun and enjoyment of it in my retirement. 	




Sure wish both you guys lived near me!



In fact, I'm drifting towards going to Rotax school myself at some point out of simple desperation. Right now, if something goes wrong with my 912 that isn't just simple line maintenance, I'm screwed. It'd have to come off the plane and go to Miss. or FL or somewhere. 



Back when I flew the 503 I was able to do a bit more invasive stuff because I have the entire 2-stroke toolset (minus a couple specific to the 582) but on the 912 there isn't anyone anywhere near here that's qualified to actually work on it.



Also, the toolset for the 912 is as much as an engine if you get the entire thing. So that probably makes it even more unusual to find folks who can actually do teardowns on a sick 912.  But if I go to school, I'll probably get some of the basic tools....



LS

_________________
LS
Titan II SS

flyadive(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Mon Dec 13, 2010 6:16 am Post subject: What to look for in a good Mechanic

Hey Thom:



Love the way you think.

There should also be a 15A.

I lost a job because I told the customer-to-be it would cost him $175 for one hour of my time which included travel; to fix gas leak in a wing.  The guy that got the job charged him $2000 and the plane was down for about two weeks.  

 Bottom line... I hope he got KISSED!

Barry



On Mon, Dec 13, 2010 at 8:51 AM, Thom Riddle <riddletr(at)gmail.com (riddletr(at)gmail.com)> wrote:

 [quote]--> RotaxEngines-List message posted by: "Thom Riddle" <riddletr(at)gmail.com (riddletr(at)gmail.com)>

  

 Roger,

 

 Item 15:

 I'm glad you left that one open for interpretation, because my partner and I don't charge as much as most mechanics because our overhead is lower, we are both retired and do mechanic work for others because we enjoy helping them and keeping our hands in it. Plus my partner has to stay "actively engaged" to keep his I/A current. We are part-timers and we like it that way so we have an actual retirement life outside of work. If it stops being fun, I'll quit doing it.

  

 We stay as busy as we want to with work most A&Ps around here won't touch... experimental aircraft, but also do type certificated airplane maintenance and inspection. We enjoy working on the Rotax and Jabiru engines because they are great engines but largely misunderstood by many A&Ps.

  

 I'm in it for the fun and enjoyment of it in my retirement.

 

 --------

 Thom Riddle

 Buffalo, NY (9G0)

 Kolb Slingshot SS-021

 Jabiru 2200A #1574

 Tennessee Prop 64x32

 

 

 “Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts.”

 Daniel Patrick Moynihan

 

 

 

 

 Read this topic online here:

 

 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=323152#323152

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Roger Lee

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1464
Location: Tucson, Az.

Posted: Mon Dec 13, 2010 6:23 am Post subject: Re: What to look for in a good Mechanic

Hi Thom,



I'm like you, retired and like what I'm doing. Keeps me busy. I also instruct for AZ Homeland Security in between plane maint. I know different parts of the country charge different rates and different people have different overhead. I don't have any overhead either so my rates are a little cheaper. That's why I kind of left #15 on rates open, because there are variables. It was just something to consider while your looking around. By far the other items are more important.



I should have added in my little blog that when you find a good mechanic that does a good job for you and you get along with well, be nice to them, sometimes they are hard to come by.

_________________
Roger Lee
Tucson, Az.
Rotax Instructor & Rotax IRC
Light Sport Repairman
Home 520-574-1080 TRY HOME FIRST
Cell 520-349-7056

rickofudall

Joined: 19 Sep 2009
Posts: 1392
Location: Udall, KS, USA

Posted: Mon Dec 13, 2010 7:08 am Post subject: What to look for in a good Mechanic

Of course the flip side of this is the guy who pencil whips an annual and hurts everybody involved.Case in point. Customer has his newly acquired aircraft delivered to me for assembly and test flight following ground shipping. I had already pinpointed 7 things that needed to be fixed based on pictures the previous owner sent to the buyer. Not big things. Stuff like wrong tubing used for pulse line from engine to fuel pump, head vent line at low end of engine rather than high end, those kind of little detail things. When plane arrives, we find main spar carry through holes wobbled out so big I'll have to make bushings to correct, drag spar fitting loose and rattling, covering worn through for 12" on wing root where gap cover overlaps, tail wires improperly swaged, carburetor boots severely cracked, plane is overweight by almost 200 lb. from empty weight listed in the logs, and those are just the obvious problems. Since, according to the seller, the wings were off the plane at the time and there is no time recorded on the Hobbs since the "inspection" was performed it's hard to believe these items were missed. 

 Obviously the seller got what he wanted, a good conditional inspection to aid in the sale, the A & P made a quick buck, the buyer gets the bill to return the aircraft to safe condition, and I get some work after I deliver the bad news. Of course the other obvious question is what would have happened had the buyer just accepted delivery, set up and gone flying? Scares me to think about it.

 



Rick Girard



On Mon, Dec 13, 2010 at 8:23 AM, Roger Lee <ssadiver1(at)yahoo.com (ssadiver1(at)yahoo.com)> wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   --> RotaxEngines-List message posted by: "Roger Lee" <ssadiver1(at)yahoo.com (ssadiver1(at)yahoo.com)>

 

 Hi Thom,

 

 I'm like you, retired and like what I'm doing. Keeps me busy. I also instruct for AZ Homeland Security in between plane maint. I know different parts of the country charge different rates and different people have different overhead. I don't have any overhead either so my rates are a little cheaper. That's why I kind of left #15 on rates open, because there are variables. It was just something to consider while your looking around. By far the other items are more important.

  

 I should have added in my little blog that when you find a good mechanic that does a good job for you and you get along with well, be nice to them, sometimes they are hard to come by.

 

 --------

 Roger Lee

 Tucson, Az.

 Light Sport Repairman - Maintenance Rated

 Rotax Repair Center

 Home 520-574-1080  TRY HOME FIRST

 Cell 520-349-7056

 

 

 

 

 Read this topic online here:

 

 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=323165#323165

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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 ="_blank">www.aeroelectric.com

 ooks.com" target="_blank">www.buildersbooks.com

 et="_blank">www.homebuilthelp.com

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 le, List Admin.

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 -List" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RotaxEngines-List

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-- 

Zulu Delta

Kolb Mk IIIC

582 Gray head

4.00 C gearbox

3 blade WD

Thanks, Homer GBYM

It is not bigotry to be certain we are right; but it is bigotry to be unable to imagine how we might possibly have gone wrong.

  - G.K. Chesterton



 

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lucien

Joined: 03 Jun 2007
Posts: 721
Location: santa fe, NM

Posted: Mon Dec 13, 2010 7:38 am Post subject: Re: What to look for in a good Mechanic

 	  rickofudall wrote: 	
		  Stuff like wrong tubing used for pulse line from engine to fuel pump

	




Heh, funny you mention the pulse line. This is such a simple part of a 2-stroke installation that's just amazingly misunderstood. 



My last exchange over on the Kolb list before leaving was a fight over the pulse line length. It was simply amazing how aggressive the attacks on me were when I insisted it needed to be a foot and half long at a maximum (the Rotax spec is 20" at the longest, but that's a maximum value that you don't really want to use for a truly safe installation, _especially_ if the pump has to lift fuel any appreciable distance). I finally had to leave the list because I was even getting PM's about ruffling the feathers of one of the "gurus" on the list who seemed to think it was ok to have one too long (he's a 912 driver with not a lot of Rotax 2-stroke time).



But this is actually the single most neglected and violated safety issue with the 2-strokes. I've seen installations with this line over 2' long, and that was specified by the factory in one case! The owner of that particular plane was constantly having fuel starvation issues, very dangerous. 



It's often thought that as long as line is made of the right material, the pulse line can be as long as you please. But the limiting factor is the compliance of the air column in the line, not the stiffness of the lines themselves. So even if it's solid steel brake line, you don't want to run more than about 1.5 feet on this line.



But I'm still stunned by how hard people fight back on this and still want to run these mile-long pulse lines. It's almost as if they want a safety issue on the plane just because the pump looks so pretty bolted onto a firewall a mile away from the motor .



So that's another thing that can really frustrate you when helping someone out with their installation, etc. - they'll sometimes really fight you on it....



LS

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LS
Titan II SS

Last edited by lucien on Mon Dec 13, 2010 7:45 am; edited 3 times in total

Thom Riddle

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1597
Location: Buffalo, NY, USA (9G0)

Posted: Mon Dec 13, 2010 7:42 am Post subject: Re: What to look for in a good Mechanic

Rick,



I experienced something similar about four years ago. A customer bought a Challenger from Minnesota (I think) without looking at it, because the owner had a recent annual condition inspection and told the buyer he had been flying regularly, at least weekly, for the past year. When it arrived by truck, from a distance it looked good, i.e., the fabric and paint were nice and no obvious corrosion etc.



Fortunately, it was structurally sound but had dozens of little things that revealed what a blatant lier the seller was. Tires were flat, the fuel in the tank was the color of molasses, the battery was beyond servicing, etc. The logbook condition inspection entry was obviously done without actually inspecting anything and the time in service since the previous one, well over a year earlier, was about 4 hours. It cost our customer nearly a $1,000 to get it to the point where it was safe and able to fly. He was lucky because it could have been much worse.



I don't even know if the guy who signed the condition inspection was a real person with a valid mechanic certificate number, but if he was, he should have his ticket yanked.



Caveat Emptor

_________________
Thom Riddle
Buffalo, NY (9G0)

Don't worry about old age... it doesn't last very long.
- Anonymous

Roger Lee

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1464
Location: Tucson, Az.

Posted: Mon Dec 13, 2010 10:25 am Post subject: Re: What to look for in a good Mechanic

Hi Guys,



You guys just showed me and everyone that wants to get away too cheap or has little to no knowledge about their plane for standards on proper maint. or a proper inspections. Some have someone do the maint. or inspection that really doesn't have a clue, but has A&P or LSRM-A after his name. It really behoofs people to seek out someone that has some knowledge and education to help do the maint. It can and does save you money and horror stories later. May even save your life.

_________________
Roger Lee
Tucson, Az.
Rotax Instructor & Rotax IRC
Light Sport Repairman
Home 520-574-1080 TRY HOME FIRST
Cell 520-349-7056

KeysFox

Joined: 05 Jan 2009
Posts: 137

Posted: Mon Dec 13, 2010 12:16 pm Post subject: What to look for in a good Mechanic

Having had ownership in over two dozen planes over quite a few years now,

I have to agree that finding the right maintainence shop(s) or person(s)

with knowlege, experience, training, skills, and ethics to do the

maintainence or provde the assistance needed can be a pocketbook and life

saver.



BJ

Kitfox IV N154K

PA 39 Turbo N626NR




 	  Quote: 	
		  

 Hi Guys,



 You guys just showed me and everyone that wants to get away too cheap or

 has little to no knowledge about their plane for standards on proper

 maint. or a proper inspections. Some have someone do the maint. or

 inspection that really doesn't have a clue, but has A&P or LSRM-A after

 his name. It really behoofs people to seek out someone that has some

 knowledge and education to help do the maint. It can and does save you

 money and horror stories later. May even save your life.



 --------

 Roger Lee

 Tucson, Az.

 Light Sport Repairman - Maintenance Rated

 Rotax Repair Center

 Home 520-574-1080  TRY HOME FIRST

 Cell 520-349-7056





 Read this topic online here:



 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=323193#323193

_________________
B Jones
N154K
443-480-1023

pchristensen10(at)austin.
Guest

Posted: Mon Dec 13, 2010 12:35 pm Post subject: What to look for in a good Mechanic

This one looks good.  Saw her on Barnstormers.

     

     [img]cid:part1.05060503.01020208(at)austin.rr.com[/img]

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