Matronics Email Lists :: View topic - snorkel for alternator cooling

Matronics Email Lists
Web Forum Interface to the Matronics Email Lists

Get Email Distribution Too! FAQ Search Memberlist Usergroups Register

Profile Log in to check your private messages Log in

snorkel for alternator cooling

Matronics Email Lists Forum Index -> AeroElectric-List

View previous topic :: View next topic

Author Message

jgamtmann2(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Fri Aug 17, 2012 10:27 am Post subject: snorkel for alternator cooling

Hello all, This is only marginally electric, but I need information.  My RV6 has no alternator cooling other than the (reverse rotation) internal cooling fan.  I'd like to install a snorkel to capture some cooling air at the air inlet ramp and lead it (tru a hose) to the rear of the alternator.  Does anyone know of a source for these little alum. snorkels?  I have no means to weld, braze or solder alum.  I guess that I could make one out of an old tin can, but that's kind of tacky.

 



Regards, Jurgen Amtmann  

<jgamtmann2(at)gmail.com (jgamtmann2(at)gmail.com)> 

  [quote][b]

FisherPaulA(at)johndeere.
Guest

Posted: Fri Aug 17, 2012 11:06 am Post subject: snorkel for alternator cooling

How about Aircraft Spruce? http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/ductflanges.php

 

 - Paul

 

From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Janet Amtmann

Sent: Friday, August 17, 2012 1:25 PM

To: aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com

Subject: snorkel for alternator cooling



 

Hello all, 

This is only marginally electric, but I need information.  My RV6 has no alternator cooling other than the (reverse rotation) internal cooling fan.  I'd like to install a snorkel to capture some cooling air at the air inlet ramp and lead it (tru a hose) to the rear of the alternator.  Does anyone know of a source for these little alum. snorkels?  I have no means to weld, braze or solder alum.  I guess that I could make one out of an old tin can, but that's kind of tacky.



 



Regards, Jurgen Amtmann  



<jgamtmann2(at)gmail.com (jgamtmann2(at)gmail.com)> 

 	  Quote: 	
		    http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-Listhttp://forums.matronics.com</        - List Contribution Web Site -[/b] 	
0 	  Quote: 	
		   	
1

 [quote][b]

nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelect
Guest

Posted: Fri Aug 17, 2012 11:18 am Post subject: snorkel for alternator cooling

At 01:25 PM 8/17/2012, you wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  Hello all,

This is only marginally electric, but I need information.  My RV6 

has no alternator cooling other than the (reverse rotation) internal 

cooling fan.  I'd like to install a snorkel to capture some cooling 

air at the air inlet ramp and lead it (tru a hose) to the rear of 

the alternator.  Does anyone know of a source for these little alum. 

snorkels?  I have no means to weld, braze or solder alum.  I guess 

that I could make one out of an old tin can, but that's kind of tacky.


	


     Are you sure you need one? I'm aware of

     no alternator installations in an RV that

     experienced difficulties attributable to

     overheating.



     Is there something different about the

     way your alternator is installed where

     it has been confirmed that extra-ordinary

     cooling is needed?



     Way back when, we used to do max hot day

     climbs at best angle with an alternator

     at full load . . . and then justify the

     state of the machine's cooling. Truth is

     that an alternator never gets operated that

     way. So what ever cooling was added to meet

     that capricious demand was wasted effort.

   Bob . . .

ftyoder(at)yoderbuilt.com
Guest

Posted: Fri Aug 17, 2012 5:05 pm Post subject: snorkel for alternator cooling

Maybe cut one out of an old aluminum lawn chair  leg?

 [quote]   ---

markdonahue(at)earthlink.
Guest

Posted: Fri Aug 17, 2012 6:25 pm Post subject: snorkel for alternator cooling

can you use the flexible 5/8 in corragated plastic material that we are using to direct air to our magnetos and alternators on the RV 9?  Van sells it.

Mark Donahue

From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of F. Tim Yoder

Sent: Friday, August 17, 2012 6:04 PM

To: aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com

Subject: Re: snorkel for alternator cooling

Maybe cut one out of an old aluminum lawn chair leg?

[quote]

---

Kellym

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1700
Location: Sun Lakes AZ

Posted: Fri Aug 17, 2012 6:43 pm Post subject: snorkel for alternator cooling

I wouldn't recommend it. It is nylon material  IIRC. OK but not great 

for warm temps under cowling.

Scat tube would be the aviation product of choice.



On 8/17/2012 7:24 PM, mark donahue wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  

 can you use the flexible 5/8 in corragated plastic material that we 

 are using to direct air to our magnetos and alternators on the RV 9?  

 Van sells it.



 Mark Donahue



 *From:*owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com 

 [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] *On Behalf Of 

 *F. Tim Yoder

 *Sent:* Friday, August 17, 2012 6:04 PM

 *To:* aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com

 *Subject:* Re: snorkel for alternator cooling


	




-----

No virus found in this message.

Checked by AVG - www.avg.com

_________________
Kelly McMullen
A&P/IA, EAA Tech Counselor # 5286
KCHD

raymondj(at)frontiernet.n
Guest

Posted: Fri Aug 17, 2012 8:48 pm Post subject: snorkel for alternator cooling

FWIW Here's some dead soft aluminum tubing.  I don't know if 5/8 is 

large enough for your needs.



http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/mepages/3003versatube.php



Raymond Julian

Kettle River, MN.



"And you know that I could have me a million more friends,

and all I'd have to lose is my point of view." - John Prine



On 08/17/2012 01:25 PM, Janet Amtmann wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   Hello all,

 This is only marginally electric, but I need information.  My RV6 has no

 alternator cooling other than the (reverse rotation) internal cooling

 fan.  I'd like to install a snorkel to capture some cooling air at the

 air inlet ramp and lead it (tru a hose) to the rear of the alternator.

   Does anyone know of a source for these little alum. snorkels?  I have

 no means to weld, braze or solder alum.  I guess that I could make one

 out of an old tin can, but that's kind of tacky.



 Regards, Jurgen Amtmann

 <jgamtmann2(at)gmail.com <mailto:jgamtmann2(at)gmail.com>>



 *

 *

JohnCiolino(at)carolina.r
Guest

Posted: Fri Aug 17, 2012 11:16 pm Post subject: snorkel for alternator cooling

Here’s what I did:  ACS sells a 1”  aluminum flange (p/n 10350-4). Drill a 1” hole in the inlet ramp and rivet the flange in place.

If you are good at bending aluminum tubing also order some 1” tubing and you are all set.

 

I tried that and couldn’t get the tubing bent without kinking so I used some 1” SCAT tubing. To keep the tubing in place I took a strip of flat aluminum, bent it to direct the tubing to the alternator and attached it to the flange with a hose clamp.  I attached the tubing to the aluminum with tie wraps.

 

Good luck.

 

John Ciolino

RV-8

N894Y

 

From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Janet Amtmann

Sent: Friday, August 17, 2012 2:25 PM

To: aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com

Subject: snorkel for alternator cooling

 

Hello all, 

This is only marginally electric, but I need information.  My RV6 has no alternator cooling other than the (reverse rotation) internal cooling fan.  I'd like to install a snorkel to capture some cooling air at the air inlet ramp and lead it (tru a hose) to the rear of the alternator.  Does anyone know of a source for these little alum. snorkels?  I have no means to weld, braze or solder alum.  I guess that I could make one out of an old tin can, but that's kind of tacky.



 



Regards, Jurgen Amtmann  



<jgamtmann2(at)gmail.com (jgamtmann2(at)gmail.com)> 

 	  Quote: 	
		    http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List 	
0 	  Quote: 	
		   	
1 	  Quote: 	
		   	
2 	  Quote: 	
		   	
3 	  Quote: 	
		   	
4 	  Quote: 	
		   	
5 	  Quote: 	
		   	
6 	  Quote: 	
		   	
7

   [quote][b]

chris_hand(at)comcast.net
Guest

Posted: Fri Aug 17, 2012 11:55 pm Post subject: snorkel for alternator cooling

I used the corrugated tubing from Vans for alternator cooling on my -6A and it works fine. Feeds from inlet ramp on that side down to alternator and haven't had a problem with it, flying about 4 years / 310 hours or so.  The tube grooves and a little rtv have held it in place without issue. Light, easy, and inexpensive. 

Chris

On Aug 17, 2012, at 7:42 PM, Kelly McMullen <kellym(at)aviating.com> wrote:

 	  Quote: 	

 I wouldn't recommend it. It is nylon material  IIRC. OK but not great for warm temps under cowling.

 Scat tube would be the aviation product of choice.

 On 8/17/2012 7:24 PM, mark donahue wrote:

> 

> can you use the flexible 5/8 in corragated plastic material that we are using to direct air to our magnetos and alternators on the RV 9?  Van sells it.

> 

> Mark Donahue

> 

> *From:*owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *F. Tim Yoder

> *Sent:* Friday, August 17, 2012 6:04 PM

> *To:* aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com

> *Subject:* Re: snorkel for alternator cooling

> 

> 

 -----

 No virus found in this message.

 Checked by AVG - www.avg.com

JohnInReno

Joined: 08 Sep 2007
Posts: 150

Posted: Sat Aug 18, 2012 5:51 am Post subject: snorkel for alternator cooling

I found a grey PVC conduit 90 degree fitting with a 4" radius at the 

Home Depot aviation electronics department. Also, look around your 

favorite auto parts store for a pre-shaped  radiator hose.

john

On 8/17/2012 7:42 PM, Kelly McMullen wrote:

 	  Quote: 	

 <kellym(at)aviating.com>

 I wouldn't recommend it. It is nylon material  IIRC. OK but not great 

 for warm temps under cowling.

 Scat tube would be the aviation product of choice.

 On 8/17/2012 7:24 PM, mark donahue wrote:

>

> can you use the flexible 5/8 in corragated plastic material that we 

> are using to direct air to our magnetos and alternators on the RV 9?  

> Van sells it.

>

> Mark Donahue

>

> *From:*owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com 

> [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] *On Behalf Of 

> *F. Tim Yoder

> *Sent:* Friday, August 17, 2012 6:04 PM

> *To:* aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com

> *Subject:* Re: snorkel for alternator cooling

 -----

 No virus found in this message.

 Checked by AVG - www.avg.com

_________________
John Morgensen
RV-9A - Born on July 3, 2013
RV4 - for sale

jonlaury

Joined: 06 Nov 2006
Posts: 336

Posted: Sat Aug 18, 2012 7:47 am Post subject: Re: snorkel for alternator cooling

Jurgen,



I've attached a photo of a possible solution. I had the same concerns as you because I have a plenum capturing all the cooling ram air and directing it through the cylinders. My engine installation is battery/electrical system dependent (fuel pumps, EFI & ignition) so I wanted a little insurance for my reversed-fan alternator.

I fabricated the alternator diode plate plenum in the picture from fiberglass and vinyl-ester resin. The resin will withstand 220 deg before going plastic. Epoxy resin systems will also work. Just check to see that the transition temp meets your needs.



You can use the stamped cooling shroud as a mold for your part.

Connect to ram air source with SCAT tube size of your choice. I used 3/4".



Good luck,

John

Franklin Alternator 001 (Large).jpg

Description:

Filesize:

123.48 KB

Viewed:

6529 Time(s)

jgamtmann2(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Sat Aug 18, 2012 8:59 am Post subject: snorkel for alternator cooling

Thanks to everyone who replied.  



Bob N.   Thanks for your explanation.  No, nothing special about my alternator installation, N-D in the standard position for a Lyc.  I was only concerned because someone who had done the cooling duct on an RV6 was concerned because I had none.  I thought better safe than sorry. 

 



Do not archive 

  [quote][b]

nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelect
Guest

Posted: Sun Aug 19, 2012 6:04 am Post subject: snorkel for alternator cooling

At 11:58 AM 8/18/2012, you wrote:

Thanks to everyone who replied.



Bob N.   Thanks for your explanation.  No, nothing special about my 

alternator installation, N-D in the standard position for a Lyc.  I 

was only concerned because someone who had done the cooling duct on 

an RV6 was concerned because I had none.  I thought better safe than sorry.



   Added cooling doesn't hurt anything . . . usually.

   We added a scupper on the fuselage of the single engine

   airplanes at Cessna way back when to bring outside

   ram air into the radio stack. I recall a flurry of

   activity over that installation when a customer

   reported damage to radios due to ingress of rain!



   On the other hand, 'things' added to any project

   has a cost of ownership in $time$ to install and

   maintain that thing . . . and loss of weight and

   volume resources for having installed it. Alternator

   cooling has been a hot topic of discussion on the

   various OBAM aviation forums since I've been

   participating. Folks have attributed many failures

   of alternators to 'a lack of cooling' but without

   supporting evidence.



   I have yet to see any MEASUREMENTS of performance

   that suggests a reduction of risk for cost or safety

   for having added cooling to the alternator.



   I'm not suggesting that you should not add the

   cooling . . . I have no basis for asserting ANY

   justification one way or the other. Intuitively,

   I have observed what happens under the hood of

   my car for an alternator that gets heavily loaded

   in the worst of local temperature and airflow

   conditions yet it has hummed along nicely for

   11+ years and 170,000 miles . . . without a forced

   air cooling feature.



   The scat tube is light, the time expended in

   the grand scheme of things is small. But it

   would be really interesting to know if the effort

   has any beneficial effect.

   Bob . . .

jonlaury

Joined: 06 Nov 2006
Posts: 336

Posted: Sun Aug 19, 2012 7:47 am Post subject: Re: snorkel for alternator cooling

 	  nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelect wrote: 	
		  At 11:58 AM 8/18/2012, you wrote:

... snip



   The scat tube is light, the time expended in

   the grand scheme of things is small. But it

   would be really interesting to know if the effort

   has any beneficial effect.

   Bob . . . 	




The cooling shroud that I built and the scat tube (7") are a few ounces and part of the "mission" of this project has been to have fun.Designing and fabbing this thing qualifies.

 Knowing that I was going to build an airplane that was dependent on electrowhizzies to keep air underneath the wheels, I asked an old-school alternator/starter repair shop guy (the kind of place with alternators up to the rafters and huge, antediluvian black machines peppered with large analog meters and cats sleeping on top) for the best way to keep alternators alive and he said to just keep the diode plate(s) cool.

So that is what I did. For both alternators  



John

Display posts from previous:

	Matronics Email Lists Forum Index -> AeroElectric-List	All times are GMT - 8 Hours
Page 1 of 1

Jump to:

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum