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Kolb landing

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pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com
Guest

Posted: Fri Aug 01, 2014 2:22 am Post subject: Kolb landing

Hi John,

  

 Not trying to frighten anyone and I don`t believe  in the Kolb Quit but you know as well as I do that the techniques for landing a  Kolb and a (say) Cessna are different.

  

 If you close the throttle just above the stall at  10 or 15ft in a Cessna its inertia will bring you in.

 if you try it in a Kolb she will shed flying  speed VERY quickly and unless you are quick, which by definition in this case,  you are NOT, she will stall like any other a/c and you do not have enough height  to recover.

 That means a hard landing at best.

  

 As i said in my post, you should land inches  above the ground NOT feet.

  

 Happy flying 

  

 Pat

  

 



   [quote][b]

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John Hauck

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)

Posted: Fri Aug 01, 2014 3:39 am Post subject: Kolb landing

If you close the throttle just above the stall at 10 or 15ft in a Cessna its inertia will bring you in.



if you try it in a Kolb she will shed flying speed VERY quickly and unless you are quick, which by definition in this case, you are NOT, she will stall like any other a/c and you do not have enough height to recover.



That means a hard landing at best.



 



As i said in my post, you should land inches above the ground NOT feet.



 



Happy flying 



 



Pat





[quote]  Close the throttle, push the stick forward to maintain airspeed, land the Kolb. john [b]

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_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama

russk50(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Fri Aug 01, 2014 4:38 am Post subject: Kolb landing

PatThink you meant this for John?

More later,

Russ



On Aug 1, 2014, at 6:21 AM, Pat Ladd wrote:

[quote]     v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} o\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} w\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} .shape {behavior:url(#default#VML);}         

   Hi John,

  

 Not trying to frighten anyone and I don`t believe  in the Kolb Quit but you know as well as I do that the techniques for landing a  Kolb and a (say) Cessna are different.

  

 If you close the throttle just above the stall at  10 or 15ft in a Cessna its inertia will bring you in.

 if you try it in a Kolb she will shed flying  speed VERY quickly and unless you are quick, which by definition in this case,  you are NOT, she will stall like any other a/c and you do not have enough height  to recover.

 That means a hard landing at best.

  

 As i said in my post, you should land inches  above the ground NOT feet.

  

 Happy flying 

  

 Pat

  

 



    	  Quote: 	
		  

	


[b]

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rickofudall

Joined: 19 Sep 2009
Posts: 1392
Location: Udall, KS, USA

Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2014 3:05 am Post subject: Kolb landing

All, Here are two photos showing the Kolb Mk III in a full flap approach and round out. Sorry my neighbor didn't get the perfect on-three landing but the photos should give you the idea.



 Rick Girard

do not archive



On Fri, Aug 1, 2014 at 7:38 AM, kinne russ <russk50(at)gmail.com (russk50(at)gmail.com)> wrote:

  	  Quote: 	
		  PatThink you meant this for John?

More later,

Russ

 

On Aug 1, 2014, at 6:21 AM, Pat Ladd wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		               

   Hi John,

  

 Not trying to frighten anyone and I don`t believe  in the Kolb Quit but you know as well as I do that the techniques for landing a  Kolb and a (say) Cessna are different.

  

 

If you close the throttle just above the stall at  10 or 15ft in a Cessna its inertia will bring you in.

 if you try it in a Kolb she will shed flying  speed VERY quickly and unless you are quick, which by definition in this case,  you are NOT, she will stall like any other a/c and you do not have enough height  to recover.

 That means a hard landing at best.

  

 As i said in my post, you should land inches  above the ground NOT feet.

  

 Happy flying 

  

 Pat

  

 



 





    	  Quote: 	
		  

	






3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D



	


	




-- 

Zulu Delta

Mk IIIC

Thanks, Homer GBYM

It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be unhappy.

   - Groucho Marx

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Larlaeb

Joined: 02 Apr 2013
Posts: 75
Location: League City, Texas United States

Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2014 5:02 am Post subject: Re: Kolb landing

I'm still a low time pilot in the Kolb, just passed 200 hours in her and I have a little less than 1000 landings now.  I try to do 2 or 3 at least every time I fly and I try to vary the type of landing I do each time.  Full flaps, no flaps, wheel, three point, over obstacle, stop short etc.  



I think the Kolb, at least my Mark III, is a pretty easy airplane to land but it is not easy to land 'perfectly' 3 point power off EVERY TIME at least for me.  As has been stated over and over it has to be flown all the way to the ground. You can't just get it in ground effect and let it land on automatic like some I have flown.   Small mistakes turn what I think is a perfect landing into an average landing with a small bounce or a little bump. 



Leaving a little power on can make it float a little more like a GA plane and I found that easier in the beginning.  Now the game is to pull all the power off on the down wind leg, not touch it again and put it where I want it, perfectly soft with as short a roll as possible. Oh yeah, and to walk away.  



(That's what I was trying to do in the short field landing video I posted a while back.)



Thanks,

Allan

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John Hauck

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)

Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2014 5:21 am Post subject: Kolb landing

Allan/Kolbers:



Homer designed his airplanes for low time pilots.  He wanted the aircraft to

sit level, or nearly level on the ground.  His reason was to require more

airspeed to take off, prevent pulling off too soon, flying out of ground

effect and stalling.  He also wanted them to land faster, thus the level

attitude.



I didn't like this level attitude.  I wanted to get the nose of the aircraft

up in a more conventional three point attitude.  This helps me get off the

ground a little quicker and land in a three point attitude.  



Homer also put most of the weight on the main gear to make his airplanes

handle better on the ground.  This works well with one exception, the

tendency to nose over because of the light tail.  I overcame this by moving

the main gear 8" forward from the stock position.  My MKIII is a now a true

tail dragger.  It is more difficult to handle on the ground, but has no

tendency to nose over in most any terrain.  There is over 100 lbs on the

tail wheel.



All the mods my Brother Jim and I did to my MKIII seem to be working well.

They have been on this MKIII for more than 22 years and 3,300.0 hours.  It

is nice to fly an airplane that satisfies all your needs.  Don't think there

is anything else to do to Miss P'fer except maintain and fly her.



Allan, I have seen your landings.  They look good.



john h

mkIII

Titus, Alabama



 

I'm still a low time pilot in the Kolb, just passed 200 hours in her and I

have a little less than 1000 landings now.  I try to do 2 or 3 at least

every time I fly and I try to vary the type of landing I do each time.  Full

flaps, no flaps, wheel, three point, over obstacle, stop short etc.  



I think the Kolb, at least my Mark III, is a pretty easy airplane to land

but it is not easy to land 'perfectly' 3 point power off EVERY TIME at least

for me.  As has been stated over and over it has to be flown all the way to

the ground. You can't just get it in ground effect and let it land on

automatic like some I have flown.   Small mistakes turn what I think is a

perfect landing into an average landing with a small bounce or a little

bump. 



Leaving a little power on can make it float a little more like a GA plane

and I found that easier in the beginning.  Now the game is to pull all the

power off on the down wind leg, not touch it again and put it where I want

it, perfectly soft with as short a roll as possible. Oh yeah, and to walk

away.  



(That's what I was trying to do in the short field landing video I posted a

while back.)



Thanks,

Allan

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_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama

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