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toner in windshield fairing

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Lew Gallagher

Joined: 04 Jan 2008
Posts: 402
Location: Greenville , SC

Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2008 2:40 pm Post subject: toner in windshield fairing

OK, Tim and others.  



I really like the idea of coloring the lower windshield fairing resin black so that it looks good from inside.  BUT, I've taken to heart those who frown on skimming over fiberglass with bondo type materials.  



Now then, I've got a good friend who is in charge of toner for Lexmark and I thought I remembered him saying that most of toner is styrene, i.e. polymer, plastic, whatever that stuff is.  So today I called him and he verified that only less than 10% of toner is carbon black.  So now I'm wondering how that affects the bonding quality of fiberglass resin mixed with toner ...?   Apparently, Tim, you've had no ill effects and you said it doesn't take much toner to turn it black, but I was just wondering if anyone has thought about this, and if there's a source of pure carbon black?



Later, - Lew

_________________
non-pilot
crazy about building
NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549
Fly off completed !

Tim Olson

Joined: 25 Jan 2007
Posts: 2882

Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2008 3:27 pm Post subject: toner in windshield fairing

Nope, no effect found.  Also, you don't want to use any bondo

like products over the fiberglass...you want to use something

like West System epoxy to do the fiberglassing, and then use

west system fairing filler and epoxy to do the filling above.



Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying

do not archive

Lew Gallagher wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   

 <lewgall(at)charter.net>

 

 OK, Tim and others.

 

 I really like the idea of coloring the lower windshield fairing resin

 black so that it looks good from inside.  BUT, I've taken to heart

 those who frown on skimming over fiberglass with bondo type

 materials.

 

 Now then, I've got a good friend who is in charge of toner for

 Lexmark and I thought I remembered him saying that most of toner is

 styrene, i.e. polymer, plastic, whatever that stuff is.  So today I

 called him and he verified that only less than 10% of toner is carbon

 black.  So now I'm wondering how that affects the bonding quality of

 fiberglass resin mixed with toner ...?   Apparently, Tim, you've had

 no ill effects and you said it doesn't take much toner to turn it

 black, but I was just wondering if anyone has thought about this, and

 if there's a source of pure carbon black?

 

 Later, - Lew

 

 -------- non-pilot crazy about building NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549 

 Engine and FF here, now cowl and baffels,waiting on prop.

 

 

 

 

 Read this topic online here:

 

 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=196210#196210

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List

coop85(at)cableone.net
Guest

Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2008 3:57 pm Post subject: toner in windshield fairing

Lew,

   No help for finding pure carbon black, but FWIW I've got almost 3 years

with the toner/resin mix and no ill effects on the canopy.



May sound silly, but how about grinding some charcoal mortar/pestle style?



Marcus

Do not archive



--

pascal(at)rv10builder.net
Guest

Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2008 4:01 pm Post subject: toner in windshield fairing

west system fairing filler 



Is that something like Microballoons and epoxy?



--------------------------------------------------

From: "Tim Olson" <Tim(at)MyRV10.com>

Sent: Saturday, August 02, 2008 4:24 PM

To: <rv10-list(at)matronics.com>

Subject: Re: toner in windshield fairing



 	  Quote: 	
		   

 

 Nope, no effect found.  Also, you don't want to use any bondo

 like products over the fiberglass...you want to use something

 like West System epoxy to do the fiberglassing, and then use

 west system fairing filler and epoxy to do the filling above.

 

 Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying

 do not archive

 

 

 Lew Gallagher wrote:

> 

> <lewgall(at)charter.net>

> 

> OK, Tim and others.

> 

> I really like the idea of coloring the lower windshield fairing resin

> black so that it looks good from inside.  BUT, I've taken to heart

> those who frown on skimming over fiberglass with bondo type

> materials.

> 

> Now then, I've got a good friend who is in charge of toner for

> Lexmark and I thought I remembered him saying that most of toner is

> styrene, i.e. polymer, plastic, whatever that stuff is.  So today I

> called him and he verified that only less than 10% of toner is carbon

> black.  So now I'm wondering how that affects the bonding quality of

> fiberglass resin mixed with toner ...?   Apparently, Tim, you've had

> no ill effects and you said it doesn't take much toner to turn it

> black, but I was just wondering if anyone has thought about this, and

> if there's a source of pure carbon black?

> 

> Later, - Lew

> 

> -------- non-pilot crazy about building NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549 

> Engine and FF here, now cowl and baffels,waiting on prop.

> 

> 

> 

> 

> Read this topic online here:

> 

> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=196210#196210

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List 

> 

> 

>

ricksked(at)embarqmail.co
Guest

Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2008 4:18 pm Post subject: toner in windshield fairing

Yes



Rick. Sked

Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T



--

Tim Olson

Joined: 25 Jan 2007
Posts: 2882

Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2008 4:27 pm Post subject: toner in windshield fairing

They have a variety:

http://www.myrv10.com/tips/options.html



http://www.westsystem.com/

Go to the product guide



410 Microlight is just one of the things you'll use tons of.

Great stuff, sands well.  The guy who helped paint was impressed

as heck with it.



406 Colloidal silica is another one you'll use, along with one

other that I can't remember right now.



You'll go through cans and cans of 410 by the time you're done

with the project, and gallons of epoxy.  People have no idea

how much you can spend on epoxy supplies to finish the kit...it's

hundreds of dollars.



Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying

do not archive

pascal wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   

 

 west system fairing filler

 Is that something like Microballoons and epoxy?

 

 --------------------------------------------------

 From: "Tim Olson" <Tim(at)MyRV10.com>

 Sent: Saturday, August 02, 2008 4:24 PM

 To: <rv10-list(at)matronics.com>

 Subject: Re: toner in windshield fairing

 

> 

>

> Nope, no effect found.  Also, you don't want to use any bondo

> like products over the fiberglass...you want to use something

> like West System epoxy to do the fiberglassing, and then use

> west system fairing filler and epoxy to do the filling above.

>

> Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying

> do not archive

> Lew Gallagher wrote:

>> 

>> <lewgall(at)charter.net>

>>

>> OK, Tim and others.

>>

>> I really like the idea of coloring the lower windshield fairing resin

>> black so that it looks good from inside.  BUT, I've taken to heart

>> those who frown on skimming over fiberglass with bondo type

>> materials.

>>

>> Now then, I've got a good friend who is in charge of toner for

>> Lexmark and I thought I remembered him saying that most of toner is

>> styrene, i.e. polymer, plastic, whatever that stuff is.  So today I

>> called him and he verified that only less than 10% of toner is carbon

>> black.  So now I'm wondering how that affects the bonding quality of

>> fiberglass resin mixed with toner ...?   Apparently, Tim, you've had

>> no ill effects and you said it doesn't take much toner to turn it

>> black, but I was just wondering if anyone has thought about this, and

>> if there's a source of pure carbon black?

>>

>> Later, - Lew

>>

>> -------- non-pilot crazy about building NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549 

>> Engine and FF here, now cowl and baffels,waiting on prop.

>>

>>

>>

>>

>> Read this topic online here:

>>

>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=196210#196210

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List

>>

>>

>

ricksked(at)embarqmail.co
Guest

Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2008 4:57 pm Post subject: toner in windshield fairing

Gallons???  Comon. Tim... Maybe 4 quarts!! Did you glue yours together?  All smiles!



Rick Sked

40185

Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T



--

Bill Schlatterer

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 195

Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2008 6:57 pm Post subject: toner in windshield fairing

Lew, why not just try the stuff that is made for it.  I doubt they would be

selling it if it made any significant difference in strength.  This is the

link to the product at ACS.  I bought some but have not used it yet.



http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/cmpages/epoxyPigments.php



Hope this helps.



Bill S

7a Finishing

 



--

Lew Gallagher

Joined: 04 Jan 2008
Posts: 402
Location: Greenville , SC

Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2008 7:42 pm Post subject: Re: toner in windshield fairing

Well, there ya go.



Thanks, Bill !!

_________________
non-pilot
crazy about building
NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549
Fly off completed !

flywrights(at)yahoo.com
Guest

Posted: Sun Aug 03, 2008 11:16 am Post subject: toner in windshield fairing

West Marine, epoxy colorant.  Mine had to order black; they seemed to have every color but.  Comes in a small toothpaste-sized tube.  Only takes a small dribble to turn a fair amount of epoxy black. 

  

Rob 

#392 

fairing sanding and propeller work 



 

 ---

drfred(at)suddenlinkmail.
Guest

Posted: Sun Aug 03, 2008 12:42 pm Post subject: toner in windshield fairing

Putting the layers on today.   With toner.   Also using some of the 

carbon fiber to replace a couple layers of fiber glass.  Making sure the 

layer next to the window is carbon fiber.   Should give me a nice black 

inside without painting the inside of the window. 



Fred



Lew Gallagher wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   



 OK, Tim and others.  



 I really like the idea of coloring the lower windshield fairing resin black so that it looks good from inside.  BUT, I've taken to heart those who frown on skimming over fiberglass with bondo type materials.  



 Now then, I've got a good friend who is in charge of toner for Lexmark and I thought I remembered him saying that most of toner is styrene, i.e. polymer, plastic, whatever that stuff is.  So today I called him and he verified that only less than 10% of toner is carbon black.  So now I'm wondering how that affects the bonding quality of fiberglass resin mixed with toner ...?   Apparently, Tim, you've had no ill effects and you said it doesn't take much toner to turn it black, but I was just wondering if anyone has thought about this, and if there's a source of pure carbon black?



 Later, - Lew



 --------

 non-pilot

 crazy about building

 NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549

 Engine and FF here, now cowl and baffels,waiting on prop.





 Read this topic online here:



 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=196210#196210

rene(at)felker.com
Guest

Posted: Sun Aug 03, 2008 3:38 pm Post subject: toner in windshield fairing

No expert here, but I don't think you want the carbon fiber to be the first

layer, it would be in contact with the al skin and could cause a corrosion

problem.



Rene'

801-721-6080

--

Lew Gallagher

Joined: 04 Jan 2008
Posts: 402
Location: Greenville , SC

Posted: Sun Aug 03, 2008 4:17 pm Post subject: Re: toner in windshield fairing

Thanks Guys,



If our West Systems dealer here has the black, that's definitely the way to go with no worries.  We'll find out tomorrow.



Carbon same as graphite as a corrosive to aluminum?  I dunno, Rene'.



Later, - Lew

_________________
non-pilot
crazy about building
NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549
Fly off completed !

drfred(at)suddenlinkmail.
Guest

Posted: Sun Aug 03, 2008 4:19 pm Post subject: toner in windshield fairing

Rene'



By the time I had  any significant lay up on the window it's about the 4 

or 5th layer that really goes up the inside of the glass.  I put it high 

up and not in contact with the aluminum. 



Thanks for the warning. 



Fred



Rene wrote:

[quote] 



 No expert here, but I don't think you want the carbon fiber to be the first

 layer, it would be in contact with the al skin and could cause a corrosion

 problem.



 Rene'

 801-721-6080

 --

AV8ORJWC

Joined: 13 Jul 2006
Posts: 1149
Location: Aurora, Oregon "Home of VANS"

Posted: Sun Aug 03, 2008 5:13 pm Post subject: toner in windshield fairing

Carbon Black is a common ingredient in Printing Inks.  I will check with

sources from General/Frederick Levy Ink suppliers and others chemical

suppliers and report back.



John C



--

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